Attn : Bill Weiss... Re : SC # 164

Is there a backscan available for us to view?

Anyone out there as curious as I am to see
this "wonder of philately" ?

Not that I know of, but this stamp has, I believe, been sold by some big auction houses in the past. I think Siegel sold it many years ago as part of the Engle Collection.

Wait a second. I thought you were asking about the unused #142, but I just realized your title says #164! So which one are you really talking about?

Talking about the 164... pardon the change of subject...

Is anyone else totally bemused by this thread ?

It's ok if you are, LB1! This seemingly random question came out of another thread about an unused US 142.

Brian

LB1 and Brian... it's not a random question... as you both well know - the 164 is (also) a 24 cent purple, and the only known certified copy of it sold for close to $400K about 10 years ago... Continental with vertically ribbed paper... the 142 doesn't even compare to it as a rarity... Bill Weiss knows quite a bit about it...

The best image of the #164 can be found on the Siegel website. There is no scan of the back available that I know of - and what would we need with a scan of the back anyway? I guess I don't understand the question exactly.........

Well... wouldn't the back of the stamp (versus the front) have been the primary surface to examine and verify : a) Continental, and b) ribbed paper?

I would not assume the identification was made with the naked eye...

With all due respect to the posters here, I have to say the thread makes no sense to a non-USA classic collector and is both poorly titles and without explanation.
It looks more like a personal email or messsage to someone which I believe is frowned upon by Admin and Mods.




I'm afraid I do NOT 'well know'. More proof, if it were needed, of the curious posts in this poorly-titled thread.

Londonbus1

Londonbus1 ~~~>

Here... get educated on what a 164 is...

http://www.siegelauctions.com/dynam...%207,%202004

Geez... maybe I should go on the British
philatelic sites and complain that I don't
know what they're talking about because
I do not collect the UK...


((( pats self on back )))

Well... wouldn't the back of the stamp (versus the front) have been the primary surface to examine and verify : a) Continental, and b) ribbed paper?

I would not assume the identification was made with the naked eye...

For those confused by the thread, we are talking about the only certified copy of the United States 1873 24c Continental Banknote Company stamp (Scott #164) which can not be differentiated from the National stamp because they were printed from the same plate and no "secret mark" has ever been discovered on the #164 (which makes sense if they were printed from the same plate!). So the ONLY way we currently can identify a #164 is by the ribbed paper, which is believed to only a product of the CBNCo.

And yes, it is identified with the "naked eye" just by viewing the stamp in reflected light so that you can see the ribbed paper. When I first saw it at a show in Atlantic City, I merely looked at it in reflected light and immediately saw the ribbed paper, which is the exact same ribbed paper seen on the other values of the 1873 stamp. Easy to identify.

Thank you, Bill, for your clarification...

Given the factor of only 40 lines per inch,
I guess it's reasonable and understandable
how the identification (could be achieved)
with the naked eye, versus magnification...

Quoting Siegel...

"Ribbed paper shows either horizontal or vertical ribbed lines at the rate of approximately 40 lines per inch"...

My only wonderment was why this most significant factor
was not exemplified with a scan by Siegel or recorded
elsewhere, given hypothetical cases of further discovery
of additional copies by a backscan...

Viewing Siegel's scan I can't see the ribbing...



Additionally, using the magnifier on Siegel's site
(link below) I'm still not seeing the ribbing...

http://www.siegelauctions.com/lot_g.../2020&symbol[]=All&lotclass=All&syear=All&pfoper=All&pseoper=All&pfgrade=&psegrade=&gandor=or&keyword=&catselect=eq&pscolumn=default&pssortby=&sortord=DESC&photo=&calledfrom=lkp

Bottom left I see what might be two vertical lines.

stampcrow... thank you... I believe I see
what you see... I'll use my scanner software
and enhance the image tonight when I get
home from work and examine further...

I collect US, and I was utterly confused by the absence of an explanation or a clear question at first. Looks like even Mr Weiss was thrown off for a minute or so! But I think I have got it now.
One big question that I do not see anyone talking about. I see the lines Stampcrow mentions, just next to the perfs. I also see, at least on my computer, about five more or less diagonal lines smack in the middle of the stamp, just under the cancel. One line looks like it goes almost up to the nose. Does anybody know what these are?

Peter