Lets Start Making Our Own Certs.....he Is???

Conflict of interest much?

Not to mention possible copyright infringement
on the cert's layout, format, etc...

You should alert the relevant authorities on this like the APS, PF, SCADS, etc.

Playing Devil's advocate, this seller is well within his right to issue a certificate of authenticity - who are we to say he is not an expert? Additionally, a certificate is also insurance for the buyer that this dealer is staking his reputation on.

As far as reporting him - to what end? He doesn't list an APS member number, nor does anyone have any proof that he is commiting fraud. All he states is that the stamp has been examined and it has been determined to be an authentic 95.

However, formatting and copyrights are another issue altogether. If he copied another company's formatting, he could be in trouble.

Stepping away from the role of advocate, I wouldn't trust this seller or his certificates if they were free.

Just my 2c

Brian

More Devil's advocacy; I suppose anyone selling anything under any format can issue a written document of an opinion that something is authentic. An opinion is just that an opinion. Is it a conflict of interest in this case? Maybe. If they were a recognized expert would it be different? If Bill Weiss were to (and I very much doubt he would not) offer an item for sale on E-Bay and used his own certificate, would that be viewed differently than this one? Perhaps so since he is recognized for his expertizing experience. The seller has sold many items and has 100% positive feed back. Does that mean he is or is not qualified to "expertise"? I don't know what their level of expertize is. They have a stated 14 day return policy that doesn't seem to be restrictive--in case they are wrong.

I wonder what their though process for developing and using this "certificate" is? Why did they do it?

Personally, I think it probably isn't a good business decision/practice to do what they have done since its clear they have a vested interest in the outcome. If they are to go into the expertizing business and eventually be come respected for their opinions, would it then become a different issue? Maybe yes, maybe no.

Just to be curious, has anyone had a bad experience with this seller in the past?

All this is just, well, my opinion.

I'm inclined to think the main reason to issue his own certificate was so he could add the words "with certificate" in the item title, and pick up a few more views without shelling out anything for a cert from a recognized authority. If you bought an item from him with one of his certs, and sold it two years later to someone who had it certified by one or two of the recognized authorities who nixed it, would he be inclined to issue a refund because it was later shown by consensus to be bad? I doubt it. Unless his cert amounted to a money back guarantee of authenticity without time limit, which some dealers do offer, I would say he is just blowing smoke.

I skimmed through all of his listings
and came across another with his cert...

http://img1.iwascoding.com/4/paid/2...90604697.jpg

Interestingly, I printed both certs, and my
hand scanner will not read either of his barcodes...

hmmmmmm....

If I was you I would ask him questions the assumptions while entertaining is really kinda sounding like a blackballing lynch mob mentality. who knows he might be a great expert after 40 years.

(click on his ebay name this is what you get)

We have been in this business for over 40 years. We are the largest dealer in South Florida. We stand by our items and have an excellent rating. We look forward to doing business with you. If you have any questions, we will gladly respond.

oh just found this too- looks like he is affiliated with the aps through his company-

WE ARE ONE OF THE LARGEST COMPANIES IN THE UNITED STATES, SPECIALIZING IN THE SALE OF US AND WORLDWIDE STAMPS. OUR PARENT COMPANY, TROPICAL STAMPS, IS A MEMBER IN GOOD STANDING WITH THE ASDA AND APS. WE HAVE BEEN IN BUSINESS FOR 40 YEARS.

By way of comparison, this whole practice of self-certification, or in coin collecting parlance, "self slabbing", is what brought about the ebay policy for coins that *only* coins certified by authorized companies could be listed as slabbed, certified, or use a numeric grade.

Sellers expertizing their own merchandise is a HUGE conflict of interest. In fact, according to APEX guidelines, if an APS expertizer receives material to expertize that originated with them, they are supposed to recuse themselves from the expertization process for that item.

Sellers should not expertize and expertizers should not sell, at least not in the same fields/specializations at any rate.

To use the old political adage, the issue is "the appearance of impropriety".

He does make this claim in the fine print:
WE ARE ONE OF THE LARGEST COMPANIES IN THE UNITED STATES, SPECIALIZING IN THE SALE OF US AND WORLDWIDE STAMPS. OUR PARENT COMPANY, TROPICAL STAMPS, IS A MEMBER IN GOOD STANDING WITH THE ASDA AND APS. WE HAVE BEEN IN BUSINESS FOR 40 YEARS.

I wonder what either organization would think of a seller expertizing their own material...

Dealers do that every day, they just don't write certs proclaiming it. Personally, I would avoid any dealer who does write his own certs unless I liked them and knew them for a very long time.

This is an interesting thread and it raises multiple fascinating angles. First, there is nothing wrong with a seller issuing a Guarantee certificate. I did it when I was both a retail dealer and an auction house, but mine was called my "Lifetime Guarantee Certificate" and the purpose was to guarantee that the item was "as described" for the lifetime of the seller (me!). But it never pretended to be an Expert SERVICE certificate, which is an entirely different matter. As far as I know, this seller is NOT a recognized expert service, therefore it seems to me, that unless he actively promotes that Expert Service and offers to examine, describe and certify material, for a fee, then the certificate he is issuing is only self-serving. And that poses a problem *IF* the description of the item is inaccurate. But looking at it a bit differently, if the descriptions he puts on the certs ARE 100% accurate, does that change the perception of the certificates?

I'm unsure. After all, there was a Linn's story not too long ago written by well-known Scandinavian dealer/expert Jay Smith, who explained how he issued certs both as a third-party expert service for material submitted to him *AND* on material he owned and sold. His logic was/is that his clients can be sure when he sells them something that has his cert, that it has been thoroughly examined by him and accurately described, and it also, he says, acts as a money back guarantee. So how do readers feel about that? Jay Smith *IS* recognized as a premier Scandanavian expert. And I am uncertain about it, but I think that Sergio Sismondo the well-known expertizer of (mostly) foreign material may also issue certs on his own material. In any event, it has not seemed to harm either person's reputation. So my take on it is that the public is accepting of it *IF* the issuer of the cert. IS a recognized expert service. It appears that this seller is not. That may be the difference?

Bill,

It's not that someone with a moral/ethical compass would necessarily resort to manipulating a judgment for profit. For example, I certainly would never suspect you of engaging in such a practice. However, as I mention above, the potential appearance of impropriety puts the whole system on its head. A conflict of interest such as this means dealers should never "expertize" their own material, in my opinion.

To me, one of the fundamental cornerstones of expertization is that it is a neutral third-party process, whether by an individual or committee. No one has a vested interest in the outcome. When you remove that key factor, the entire system becomes suspect.

In your current venture of wanting to protect buyers from corrupt sellers engaging in deceptive practices, you know full well how some sellers/dealers alter and/or misdescribe their merchandise for the sake of profit. How would expertization be any different?

It's like putting the fox in charge of the hen house.

In order for the collector/buyer to have confidence in the system, expertization/certification must always be a neutral third-party process.

As always, you are entitled to your opinion. I think Jay Smith and/or Sergio Sismodo (and numerous German expertizers) would likely disagree. In fact, I think I will invite Jay Smith to post here in this thread.....