409-Paste Up Coil Pair Stamps

Blazenstar, Are confusing what Scott is saying? The sheets of 400 imperforates, 408 and 409, were not first sold to a vending/affixing machine company and then returned to the post office and rouletted if that what you are thinking. The post master rouletted the full sheets and sold them over-the-counter. I don't recall any of the vending/affixing machine companies having facilities in Kansas City to manufacture stamp rolls, so I don't think the post office there would have had much ,if any, demand for imperforates. I could be wrong on that. If so, someone will surely correct that point. Vending/affixing machine companies purchased imperforate sheets of 100 stamps, used their own equipment to strip the sheets into ten strips of ten stamps then pasted the strips together to make rolls of stamps to use in their vending/affixing machines. You pair of 409 is a paste-up pair, 409V (fairly common), made for use in an affixing machine. Vending/affixing machine manufacturers began using imperforated stamps as early as 1908 and continued through the late 1920s for their patented machines. The USPO only started making imperforated stamps because of the demand for them by these companies. Initially, imperforated stamps were not made available to anyone except these companies.

Blazenstar, Read the attach to learn more about the Kansas City Roulettes.

http://www.americanstampdealer.com/....aspx?id=223

I never expressed these stamps were roulette, however, the Post office of Kansas city in 1914 had on hand stock of imperforated stamps of scott 409, formally sold for use in vending machines.My imperforated flat plate scott 409 paste up stamps were definitely used in vending machines. Scott expresses "Except for one full sheet" of 400,all were cut into panes before roulette and sold.They were known as the "Kansas City Roulettes."

The information I provided is written in a small paragraph explaining under 409 2 c carmine type 1 imperforated in my scott book.

Thank you so much Al..excellent information...now, it makes sense after viewing your information and link.. great!..Much more in detail which I truly appreciate so much. ..very interesting... The stamp vendor mentioned a brief history about this pair and including kansas city and lack in demand. I am so happy to read about the kansas roulettes more thoughly...Now, if I ever come across one during my stamp adventures in the south, the vendor better show me those initials "w.c.m" before attempting to sell it.lol ..it is so important to know about these details!

Thank you all..interesting information provided.

The Kansas City Roulettes have absolutely nothing to do with the image you posted. Two separate topics

It is about the production. Never did I write these stamps were rouletted, however they are strips from imperforated sheets would be pasted together to produce coil and sold in vending machines. Coil stamps created in l908, paste ups were seen until around time of use of rotary.(there are rotary stamps that had paste ups, but very rare)
The Post office in Kansas City had a stock of imperforated sheets of 400 of stamps of 409's,sold for use in vending machines too, but they were not in demand. The plates were called "A" plates.Plates of 400 subjects in 4 panes of 100 each.
Could the Post office in Kansas City have produced these type of stamps for vending use before they created the roulettes in l915?..the answer is yes since they sold for use in vending machines too. Imperforated sheets of 400 subjects were issued in l906 on the request of several makers of vending and affixing machines. The first coils in l908, and the paste up pairs for vending and affixing machines were known with mail o meter ,(409) shermack (409) and auto matic vending (409)each of them have distinct perforations to tell different company used for their paste up pairs, they produced. The automatic vending has 4 cuts on corners which the picture above does not. There is not one that shows photo like my pictured displayed.

My scott book does not have a 409v..it does have section for imperforated coils expressing 409 E, and 409 S.

with al's link..you can read that it was US Postal Department that issued the imperforated sheets to supply the demand for private vending companies. Instead of authorizing the destroying of the the scott 409 imperforated sheets since they became unsalable, W.Collins, post master, created the roulettes.
Very informative link..

https://www.gradedstamps.com/galler...qd5q971g2ea5

These are KC ROULETTES.....
Your is a 409V....
You have a OLD catalog.

The "V" is for vertical

Here are mine...

Don, those are gorgeous! I wonder about the pencil markings. What is ww? Would not be William Weiss, would it? I think he would not do stuff like that. And what about the 27?
OK, I need to read before asking!

Peter

No the WW is from 1919 - Wilson Wood. 27?
Don

27 is probably just a counting #....
Common for the era....

Awesome post.. That's great stuff

Well this thread took a nice turn. Thanks 51studebaker, those are nice. As I was scrolling down through your images, I wondered who MOC might be, and you answered that in your post. Thanks.