Unidentify Overprinted Indonesia Stamps.your Help Is Needed

hi,seems majority of you are stamp experts for all kind of stamps.i have a ned indie and two japanese stamps overprinted "repoeblik indonesia" in black ink but unfortunely,i could not find or get any information and photo of this overprinted everywhere on the internet.i have a few questions below about the overprinted stamps:
1.is it a genuine overprinted on all this stamps?i have seen some in red colour overprinted but not in black colour for this stamps.
2.if the black overprinted is genuine,why is it used on two difference countries stamps?please explain?
3.when was this japanese stamps used in indonesia and overprinted"repoeblik indonesia"
4.have you ever seen all this stamps with the same overprinted before?are they common or rare?

im really very confused now,hoping someone can help me to sort this mystery.i need your answer as soon as posible if you know anything about it.thank you

Hi Miko....

Intriguing items.......

This does not look like an overprint to me. It looks more like a handstamp used to cancel and show the country of use during a period when the islands were under Japanese control and that the items passed through the Japanese post office.

Another possibility is that it is counterfeit. Japan had at least partial control of many countries in the South Pacific and I've never seen this mark on anything else.

(The fact that I haven't seen it before does not prove or disprove anything.)

These stamps are not in my 2008 Scott Catalog, but I did find them in my 2004 Sakura catalog from Japan. (Much of the catalog is in Japanese but a fair portion is also in English) It shows that you have the two high values of the set (2sen & 3 1/2sen) issued Mar. 9, 1943 and they were issued for use in Java. The cancel is not shown.

I am sure that others here will also know of other possibilities.

The Japanese occupied what were the Dutch Indies from 1942-45. When the war ended, Indonesia was proclaimed an independent republic on August 17, 1945 by the national liberation movement. Stamps overprinted "REPOEBLIC INDONESIA" (as these stamps are, rather than REPUBLIK INDONESIA), appeared in Java in 1945. These overprints were on both definitives and provisionals. [The information above is from The Scott Stamp Atlas.]

So it could be that the liberation movement was already afoot toward the end of the Japanese occupation or that canceling equipment left behind by the Japanese was still being used shortly thereafter. I would guess these overprints look a lot like cancels because they were applied with a rubber stamp rather than metal type in a printing press. They could be considered unofficial so are not Scott listed.

As a specialist collector on Neth. Indies/Indonesia (albeit a new one!) I concur with Modern's assesment. The Specialised PRANGKO Indonesia Catalog lists these stamps as 1945-1946 revolutionary overprints.

If you'd be interested in selling or trading for them, please advise.

Cheers!

David in Ottawa, Canada

P.S. Seems you and I have parallel collecting interests!

I never cease to be amazed at the level of experience and knowledge within the 225 or so members that we have. You guys are phenominal!

once again,thanks for all of your comments and helped.unfortunely,im getting more confused right now with the difference opinions and meaning in the comments.atleast I know the overprints are not counterfeit but still unsure it is used for cancellation or official overprint on this stamps.if what modern said is true that the overprint is used for cancellation then why I can notice another round cancellation on the japanese-occupation stamps beside that?did anyone of you notice it???please explain.are this overprinted stamps common or rarity in fact???whats its worth?please answer my questions.thank you so much.

Miko, I'm not saying the overprint is a cancellation but is an overprint applied in a similar way, that is by a rubber stamp or other device on individual stamps rather than in a printing press a full sheet at a time. My thought is that the stamps were produced by the liberation movement so are not recognized as genuine government issued stamps by Scott. They received Japanese cancels because that's what was available at the time, either shortly before or shortly after the end of the war.

modern,so are they still treated as genuine overprint stamps with some value or treated as bogus items of no value?please advice.thanks.

i saw someone selling other indonesia stamps with the same overprinted "repoeblik indonesia" but in difference ink colour which is red.i really have no idea this stamps were officially issued by the goverment or the liberation movement.here is the link http://cgi.ebay.com/Indonesia-15-ov...ia_W0QQitemZ a href= /go/link.asp?target=https://www.ebay.com/itm/-/270250561150 target= _blank rel= nofollow 270250561150 /a QQihZ017QQcategoryZ47166QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1638Q2em118Q2el1247

check it out and let me know what you think

Miko, it would take a specialist to give you some idea as to whether or not these stamps are genuine and what they might be worth. Scott apparently doesn't recognize them because the liberation movement was not the official government. But as David says, the Specialised PRANGKO Indonesia Catalog has them listed as 1945-1946 revolutionary overprints.

You might want to also try your questions at the big Australian board http://stampboards.com since you just might find a collector or collectors specializing in that region who can give you better information. (I can only tell you what Scott says and what I'm able to deduce from that, my limited experience, and the scans you show.) Stampboards.com also does a good job of policing ebay for fraudulent sellers who create "rarities," especially if these are Australian in origin. Finally, in your situation, that PRANGKO specialized catalog might be worth getting.

ok,modern.probably you might be right and I have to agree with you.david did help me too.both of you are very much helpful to me and of course I appriciated you two alot.about the Specialised PRANGKO Indonesia Catalog(LOL),sound funny and unbelievable.maybe I will try to get it too.

Miko:

those stamps are overprints... crude and locally produced. They are not cancels. Judging by the scans you are showing and the colour pictures I have in the various refernce books, they look genuine.

Keep hunting!

Where did you get them?

Cheers!

David

david,you mean the black or red overprints are genuine?the red overprint stamps are not belong to me.by the way,my dad took them from a british collector last time during warwar2 period and then passed down to me.

Both the red and the black overprints look genuine.

Using these two colours is common, worldwide, as overprint colours. Black is used on lighter-coloured stamps, and red is used on darker-coloured stamps. Why? As you can well imagine, a black overprint would not show up very well on a grey stamp, but red would. Red would show up poorly on a red-, orange-, or yellow-coloured stamp.

David

yup,youre 100% right becouse its also happend on the malaya overprinted bma stamps as well.lets come to the conclusion,are the black overprints stamps common or rare in fact?have you ever seen them before?

The black overprint is more common than the red... but the colour of the overprint does not determine how rare a stamp is, it's the number overprinted.

David