So I Called Mystic To See What Dad Spent...

Most of you know that my father collected stamps, and when
he passed I got his collection. He never taught me stamps,
but I came here and picked up where he left off, learning
much along the way.

He never got on the internet, but rather collected the old
fashion way all his life, through the mail mostly. In his
last few bedridden years, he simply ordered straight from
Mystic at greatly inflated prices.

Well, times are tough, and I am once again considering how
I might value his collection and liquidate it. First I wanted
to know how much he spent on it. I have a general idea that
through private purchases and such, he (and I) spent probably
$2000 or so on it. I knew that Mystic would be the bulk of the
expense though. I figured he might have spent as much as
$4000 through them, but wasn't sure.

So, this morning I called Mystic and explained what I was doing,
and asked if they would give me his account total...

$11,966.94

So we have "invested" at minimum $14,000 in these stamps, but
there is no way that will be recouped. Money pizzed away.

Enjoy your collections, but make sure you either have an heir
that you teach and know will enjoy what you leave behind, or
some preplanned liquidation if you do not.

I do love the stamps now that I have learned about them, and
do consider myself a collector, but at what cost!?! It is
painful to know that my father was taken advantage of in his
old age over his love of this hobby, and that he thought that
he was making a wise investment. He thought that those he left
behind would benefit more from the sale of his collection than
the amount he paid. He told me so before he passed. The only
beneficiaries to his estate was Mystic, and to heck with his
widow, disabled daughter, and grandchildren.

Dave, maybe take comfort in the fact that he was having fun with the hobby and enjoying his collecting right up until the end. The money probably didn't matter to him.

Do you mean as an actual beneficiary or just referring to the money spent?

The way I see spending on my collection is I compare my expenses to someone who loves to play golf.
We both spend money to create enjoyment at the time, although I think my enjoyment lasts considerable longer than for a golfer. After finishing a golf game, the golfer has nothing left to show for his purchased enjoyment whereas I still have my purchase. Any profit gained later simply lowers the expense I incurred for my pleasure and enjoyment.

Hi,
Lots of good thoughts.......... I'm 69, and in it for the fun.

What I've put into it is minimal - as compared to friends and neighbors with the fancy cars, vacations, maids, and yard crews.

And golf.......... well, I grew up in Chicago, and it was bowling and shooting pool. Golf & Tennis were sports of the well to do folks that lived in the suburbs.....

That is a shocker.

I can understand why you are angry.
We all have our fantasies to deal with the realities of life. Your father's, apparently, was that of being a big-time stamp collector.

I am not sure it is fair to blame Mystic. Their business is honest. They do not engage in strategies to entrap people into a cycle of addiction. They do not engage in an aggressive marketing campaign to create an illusion of the wonderful life of the big-time stamp collector.

Unlike the casinos who have bilked people like my father into the poor house.

I guess I am talking alot because I have been in a similar position, and empathize.

I wouldn't necessarily say he was taken advantage of. He was probably buying in the height of the market boom like most others in that time frame. I doubt there are many collections out there that would realize the prices that were paid to accumulate the collections in the 1950's through the 1980's.

If your Dad collected for 50 years, lets see: $14,000 divided by 50 = $280 per year. I suspect that your Dad got more than his monies worth in the pleasure that his hobby brought to him!

From what I understand, the stamp hobby went thru a similar boom as compared to the Lionel trains. Yup, I bought during the boom times, and they are now worth about 1/4 of what I paid. On the flip side, the reason I got back into stamp collecting recently is it is so affordable, as compared to years ago.

All that being said, your Father had fun, and you do have something to show for it - unlike other ways folks spend their money.

ENJOY !!

I don't know why so many people are obsessed with the financial
angle of stamp collecting and get upset when they find out that
they haven't hit the million dollar jackpot when they want to sell
Uncle Bill's live long collection of stamps.

I'm sure for the majority of us here it's a hobby.
Yes a hobby.
Like how many hobbies are a retirement fund?

I also paid full catalog when I started collecting in the sixties
but that's the way it was.
Same when I bought from Canada Post Philatelic or other
Postal services. Full value for stuff that is worth now maybe
60% face and after factoring in inflation worth basically bugger all.
Life is tough.

But heh I've lots of fun and still do with my overpriced, undervalued stamps.

Like I said it's my hobby.

The money he spent, which in his last few years he was trying to make a 'nest-egg' of sorts for
his family... Mainly his widow and disabled daughter. He would have been better off putting the
money in an envelope than "investing" in a hobby that he never bothered to share with anyone else,
making sure they had the tools to liquidate it with when he was gone. Not even mentioning the fact
that he was paying 4x what he could have bought the same things elsewhere, even at market price.

I disagree.
It's a long story, but in short, it took me two years to get them to stop sending stuff
that we didn't ask for, and sending us bills and charging fees. It took many angry phone
calls and letters to get the "approvals" to stop flooding the mailbox. I had to call my
state's AG office and Dept of Commerce. No, they don't get 100% of the blame, but 50% minimum.

He was a Mystic customer from 2005 to 2008. That's $330 a month!

He was actively buying from 2005 to 2008. Far from the height of the market.
In the 50 years he collected before those 3 years, I doubt he spent more than
$1000 total, and what he had before the Mystic years was, and still is, more
valuable that what he bought from Mystic. Since 2008, I have spent about $1000
on expanding the collection, and have at LEAST doubled it's size. That is why
I said I was expecting Mystic to report something like $4000... They charge
about 4x 'fair' market value, so $1000 x 4. If you divide $12k by 4x, then
you would expect that this portion of his collection is therefore worth $4k
anyway, but even that number seems REALLY dubious to me. If he had a complete
set of Zeps or something, for example... if he had any stamps before #64, for
example... ANYTHING from Mystic to show for it, that would be one thing, however,
most of what he got from Mystic could be used as postage and not offend anyone here.

In this particular case, 2 reasons:
1: "Uncle Bill" spent $12k on something that will honestly probably bring $1k.
Yet all the while, he was doing it in the name of leaving something of value
to take care of his family. (He had no life insurance)
2: Because he told me with his own lips, on his deathbed, that the collection
was going to pay to take care of his wife and daughter for the rest of their
lives. So he thought.

Don't make these mistakes with your families. Enjoy the hobby, but think long
and hard about any 'Albatrosses" you want to leave behind.
(Not saying the stamp collection is in and of itself an "Albatross", but it
was one of a line of bad decisions Dad made at the end of life that are seriously
biting us in the butt right now.)

Hitting a "Jackpot" has nothing to do with it. I blame Dad that we
can never recoup the full amount, and Mystic that we will never recoup
a fair amount. I would be happy to find we could recapture half of the amount spent.

I agree with the general concept stated in previous posts that the enjoyment of the hobby is worth more than the monetary value and most collectors realize up-front that they're going to spend much more on their hobby than they will ever see as a return on their (or their heirs) investment, whether it be from Mystic or any other stamp dealer or even from purchases made at their local post office.

Having said that, I am a bit surprised that Mystic would be so forthcoming in quoting to someone an actual dollar amount of what was spent in someone's account just by calling to ask. It would seem to me that is privileged information that even a family member should not be able to obtain by just a phone call. I would assume there were some privacy laws breached by someone doing so unless, of course, there may have been some legal reason to release the information.

If such information is so easily attainable by just calling Mystic, it makes one wonder who else might have access to that very same data.

I told my mother what Mystic said, and she was shocked.
She said she knew he was getting stuff from the constantly,
but thought he was only spending $30-40 a month. I probably
should have kept my mouth shut, but I was PO'd.