Belgium Scott #39-What Do You Think?

Next, a look at a fine looking 1914 20c Merode stamp I got back in 1970.

Alrighty, lets try this at home.

First, a bigger image.





1. The bottom legs of the V should not touch one another.



They are not touching, but the second leg has poor impression.

2. The line should not be forked.



It is not forked, but again poor impression overall.

3. The tip of the 5 should be rounded, not pointed or curved upwards.



Pointed upward slightly, or missing color due to poor impression.

4. Other than 1 or 2 positions on the sheet. the frame should have a break in it at this spot. On many fakes the outside frame tends to be very imperfect.



The break is there.

5. The Y shaped hair should not touch the top of the head or the hair at the base.



No touchy.

6. The delta has many shapes on forgeries but should not resemble a letter A.



Tough one.

7. This one if often wrong. There should be 9 hairs (top one can be very slight) and the 4th from the bottom will be noticeably shorter.



Check and check.

8. The hairs should not be even & should have some curves.



Hard to see due to cancel, but looks like no curves.

9. The ear is another common area. It should have a fork on the inside & specific breaks as shown.



Not good, breaks are missing.

10. There should be dots (dashes) here between the hair lines.



Looks like the dashes are there.

11. These 2 ornaments should not touch.



If we are talking about the same ornaments, then they are touching.

12. This ornament should not touch or cross the frame.



Tough one again. Looks like touching, but could be due to bad impression again.

13. There should be no color or bleeding in this area (Sperati variety trait).



If I'm right, then there is no bleeding.

14. This line should have a break in it.



Check.

15. The initials AD should be visible with a dash & 2 or 3 points above it. The frame line besides it should be thick.



The AD is visible, but an overall impression is really poor here.

F. A Fournier variety (there may be 4 or 5 of them). Some of the hairs have a definite downwards curve on them.



Looks straight to me.

S . The top one is a Sperati variety (2? exist) where the tip of the hair has a noticeable curve in it. The bottom S, Sperati put a white dot here between the A & N.



I don't really see a curve, but some bumps are visible. I was thinking of a curl not a hair curve. I think I see one.



And here is the bummer . A defined dot between A and N.

Results:

Pros: Clearing most of the key points. A roller cancel will greatly reduce the value of an original; therefore no real reason to use it on a forgery.

Cons: An overall poor impression of fine details, as well as suspicion of violation of some key points.

I really want to believe that this is a real deal, but I have a bad feeling it is not, and most likely is a Sperati forgery.

Cheers.

This is why I'm not an expert of any shape and size. I was so sure that my stamp is a forgery, but looking at this ebay stamp http://www.ebay.com/itm/Belgium-39-...em3f4019fd21 which is supposedly certified, I do not see any difference between mine and this. Same poor impression, even a dot between A and N. Ahhh I'm loosing it

Last word based on my original impression & now seeing the larger scans.

#3 This passes. The tip is rounded. Fakes have a knife point or a flat edge on the end. The bump appears on many originals.

#6 The Delta has many shapes Seranne & Earee noted about 20. This one looks passable so the jury is out

#9 It appears there is a break just above the cancel. The left top break is slight & the right one shows a very faint somewhat broken line? - inconclusive
The inside fork if nice & long. Impression issues - possible pass

#11 This seems more of an impression issue also. On some forgeries, the ornaments are joined - good enough for a pass.

#12 Definite pass. The top barely touches & the bottom of the ornament is nowhere near. Forgeries, the whole ornament is on the frame.

#15 This one has too many possible impression issues. The AD is legible
so a probable pass.

S - my bad description . I should have said CURL not curve (will amend - thank you) - definite pass

The dot - impression coincidence. I believe the forgery has a much more pronounced dot & the other Sperati traits did not seem present

Overall, like you said - as good as any on the more dependable auctions.
I would not put this one on ebay for $49.95

My area of interest is forgeries of Europe & South America so I am not specifically a Belgium "expert"

Dear nl1947

Thank you very much for your input. I'm surprised to learn that this stamp is most likely a real one. I was convinced it is a forgery. I need to revisit some other stamps from that collection, as I thought that most of the high value stamps were forgeries or reprints; some of them actually were.

I don't think I'll put it on ebay for $49.95, as there is an empty spot for #39 in my Belgium collection.

Quick question about point #15. Will the initials AD always be there if the stamp is genuine?

AD is always there in the Genuine.There is a forgery type without AD..

A most interesting thread. Thanks to all who have contributed

Thank you! Someday I'll be shopping for this stamp and I've used this thread to practice evaluating some online examples. Great information!!

From my collection ---

Very nice! I think number 12 in the description above will take some studying to understand.

Hi and thank you for a very interesting thread I'm new to stamps of Belgium but have recently bought a copy of the 5 Francs Stamp. I also was baffled that the copy that Danko was going through was most likely not a fake. The stamp I have bought seems to resemble that stamp quite a bit could any one elaborate on this if it is a fake or not ?


Korsbecker :-)

So, am I to understand that you purposely bought a forgery and paid a price for a genuine stamp? Do realize that the roller cancel on Danko's and your stamp reduce the value considerably, and the crease on your stamp reduces it even more.

I thought the points were well-covered by nl1497 and perf12.

Hi hy-brasil

Thanks for replying... No I did not buy it knowing that it was a fake as I wrote I'm new to Belgium and only read this thread after purchasing the stamp. I read the last post by nl1947 where I understood it like he meant that Dankos stamp is genuine and I think my stamp look a lot like that stamp. But looking at it again now I think the dot on my stamp is much bigger therefore probably a fake.

What is the story on the roller cancel I know it reduces the price?

Kind regards
Korsbecker

Don't knock the Pizza Cutter Roller.
They are beautiful,

Used for Bank Revenues, Parcels, uncancelled stamps on cover (Skips), and as precancels.

Note: also seen on 10c CANADA Queen Victoria.
and on a 10c FRANCE La Samuese