Ridiculous Ebay/Paypal Situation

I just thinking blocking whole countries is a bit drastic!

By the way the buyer hasn't even asked for a refund yet. The message I got (when s/he opened the two ebay cases) was that a postage update was wanted.

There is no Paypal case against me (which is why I'm wondering why the money has been suspended in my Paypal account).

Here's a look at the discussion from the buyers perspective. I buy almost exclusively via ebay paying via Paypal exactly because of the buyer protection - which indeed seems biased towards the buyer. I would suggest that more turnover is generated because buyers feel more confident to buy - that at least is how it works for me. Like someone said it's a matter of honor: I always presume the seller to have sent the item. Given the fact that a shipment may get lost in the mail I would expect sellers to factor the cost of an occasional item being lost into their prices - just like the Paypal fees.....

To tag onto SWH's post, the buyer who doesn't receive an item is out the stamps ... AND the money. And they too did nothing wrong.

shermae, the seller is in exactly the same situation.

Paypal guarantee the buyer a refund if they don't get their item/s.

This shouldn't be done at the expense of the seller, if the seller posted the item/s!

Remember sellers pay 3% of every Paypal payment they receive (or is it more now?). 3% from every sale should be factored in by Paypal as insurance against items lost in the mail or otherwise not delivered.

All well and good accept what if it was an expensive item? Seller should just take the loss when they know they sent the item??

Also some ebay members buy with the intention of getting the item for free by raising claims. The system at current being taken advantage of.

Not fair on sellers at all

Most buyers are good but sadly some are not and I would argue that sellers should be allowed to leave a negative to reflect true feedback scores.

Absolutely right there, duncanvr.

Another point that needs making: why, if someone says they haven't received their item, is there an inbuilt bias into the system to assume that it's because the seller has not posted the item? There can be few sellers who wouldn't post items. After all, what most sellers want is ongoing business and thus an ongoing customer base. A satisfied customer is a potential customer tomorrow. Sellers have far less incentive not to post than buyers have to allege non-receipt.

And why do people not stop to think about the postal system which loses tens of thousands of packages every year. This is a known fact.

How can a seller give proof of Delivery ?

Maybe if they deliver the item themselves in person and someone videos them doing it?

Amazing jimjamtwo I buy hundreds of philatelic material a week from Europe / Uk & USA and never had to raise a case on any seller. As every thing is always arriving. All sellers want ongoing business as do I. For the few ebayers that cheat the system blocking them is the best method. We are not talking many here just a few dishonest people. At the moment 100% of transactions all good due to blocking countries where there is a risk of the mail going missing. Sorry to say it but China is one of the places I won't send to due to many scams from there. On the other hand Japan is one of the best places to sell to.

jimjamtwo if you have a new buyer spend over $50 send first time Oz registered letter if your not sure if the country's postal system is safe i.e. Slovakia etc. If buyer is a regular than airmail should be fine. You could always photograph every letter as you send them at the PO, now wait till postmaster cancels them before taking the pic if thats not proof of posting then yes maybe you have to hand deliver each one:)

When you list an item, you have to decide then and there what the postage should be. I think after an item is sold you can't suddenly turn around and say, "Oh you're in country X so you have to pay $15 more for registration."

Hi jimjamtwo the registered amount should only apply to an approved bidder from a blocked country when he has pre agreed to pay the registered cost if he wins your item. If you're selling to every country you'll have to send all the buyers at airmail rate of $2.75 postage and that's where the risk is of item being lost in the mail depending on where its going. You do need to look at countries that have a likelihood of mail being lost and block them. Or you'll end up again and again in this situation. I have learned that the hard way. You can also state rates in your listings to various countries if you want to sell everywhere, there are several places I would only send registered to. Otherwise to much risk of did not receive my item being raised. You can also manage your postage rates within ebay if needed insert a registered $20 fee to those countries and $2.75 to everywhere else.

I would still contact the buyer directly to see if you can reason with them to buy some more time. There's been several times where I've been contacted by a buyer wondering when an item is posted. I tell them and also tell them to wait a week or two. More often than not the item arrives and all is well. Maybe it is rude for a buyer to automatically raise a claim, but sometimes they do it because they were shafted by other sellers in the past or their English skills are limited. Whichever way, hold the higher moral ground and being nice sometimes helps in the long run.

I also would not block a whole country over one lost shipment, otherwise I would have to block the United Kingdom and even my own country. As Jeb Bush said, "Stuff happens".

Unfortunately the postal systems of ALL countries are not perfect. However, it is typical that the seller is on the hook unless proof of delivery can be had. This goes the same for big sites like Amazon too. I think we would all agree that if we were not to receive a shipment from Amazon, you know we would get a refund or a replacement. Of course they track everything so they are protected. I understand that registered mail is expensive. It's a bundle in the U.S. too and I rarely use it since most items I sell are fairly cheap too. Still my loss rate is very, very low - less than 1%. It's just the risk you have to take and luckily most people are honest.

There's also another possible scenario - if you screwed up the address, it may be returned to you, but it can take sometimes up to 6 months to be returned. I accidently did this on a shipment to South Africa. I reversed the box numbers on the street address and it took 6 months to come back. The buyer received a refund months earlier. It happens to all of us.

Drastic or not, excluding certain areas is a personal decision faced by all sellers who use the venue and experience problems with certain geographical areas. My exclusion list includes:

Africa, South America, Russian Federation, Italy, China

because that is where most of my problems have come from, through the years. It is not a personal thing, and I do make exceptions from time to time.

As a seller, I would not automatically assume that a buyer who says they didn't receive something was trying to scam me. I would believe them, make good on it, and move on. If there are too many instances, I would block geographical areas to limit the damage.

When you choose a particular venue to sell, you have to play by their rules... Or be prepared to make good on lost items - it comes with the territory.

John

Those are my excluded countries as well. I also block all Eastern Europe. It's not so much that there are a lot of crooked buyers in those places, it's that many of these people have poor English skills. They cannot read an item description then after getting their purchase are yelling about some fault you clearly described in your listing. I have had buyers pull this same stuff on me several times. Two in Poland, two in Ukraine and one in Latvia. It's just not worth it any longer.