US Stampless Folded Letter 1810/1811 - Fascinating!

Here's a piece I picked up at the Old Book and Paper Show in Toronto yesterday. I knew the date when I bought it, but was quite surprised when I really looked at it last night.



Postmarked from Norfolk VA. to New York, it was actually written in Coppet Switzerland on November 12 1810. Written in French, so I'll have to get a translation done.

At some point it was sent to Norfolk where it was then mailed to New York. Notations inside give a timeline.



The letter writer is Auguste de Stael Holstein, the son of Anne Louise Germaine de Staël-Holstein a writer and outspoken critic of Napleon. Auguste wrote this letter at the tender age of 20 or 21. He would only live to he age of 37, passing away in 1827.




Here's a portrait of Auguste painted by François Gérard

Hmm. A letter to his mother; is he asking for money?

Ha, not Mom.
LeRoy Bayard and McEvers according to Founders Online (National Archives) -

LeRoy, Bayard & McEvers, a mercantile firm in New York City, began business as LeRoy and Bayard by 1787. The founding partners were William Bayard (1761–1826) and Herman LeRoy (ca. 1758–1841). The firm was known as LeRoy, Bayard & McEvers from about 1796 until the retirement in 1816 of James McEvers (d. 1817). It continued to operate as LeRoy, Bayard & Company in New York City until at least 1827, providing both mercantile and banking services.

That's why I'll need to get a translation.

Hi, jamesw,

If still searching for a translation, here you are:


CDS: Norfolk VA. FEB. 5

Messieurs Le Roy, Bayard & McEvers
New-York


Coppet 12 November 1810
Aug. Staël Holstein
Received 12 February 1811
Answered 10 May


Coppet 12 novembre 1810
J'ai l'honneur de vous annoncer, Messieurs, que ma mere a reçu votre lettre du
I have the honor to inform you, gentlemen, that my mother has received your letter of
26 Julliet ou vous lui mandez que Mr Le Roy de Chaumont a versé chez
26 July where you let her know that Mr Le Roy of Chaumont paid to
vous $ 7,407 en payement de 40,000 Fr de France: elle vous prie d'agréer
you the sum of $ 7,407 equivalent to 40,000 French francs. Please accept
tous ses remerciments de la déduction de commission a la quelle vous avez bien
her thanks for the deduction of the commission you kindly
voulu consentir. Elle me charge aussi, Messieurs, de vous confirmer la lettre qu'elle a
agreed to. She also asks me, gentlemen, to confirm the letter she
eu l'honneur de vous écrire dernierement par le Flash, elle se flatte, je l'avoue,
had the honor to write to you recently via the Flash, she compliments herself, I admit,
que vous voudrez bien accéder a l'augmentation d'intérets qu'elle vous a
on you kindly granting consent to the increase of interest she
demandée, d'autant plus que la somme que vous avez a elle va s'accroître considé-
required, especially as the amount to her credit will increase consider-
rablement par les versements que Mr Le Roy fera désormais chez vous; si
ably owing to the remittances that Mr. Le Roy will now make to you; if,
pourtant, ce que j'éspere ne sera pas, il vous était difficile de donner a
nevertheless, I hope this will not be the case, it would be difficult for you to give
ma mere le 6 %, elle vous prierait de vouloir bien le indiquer a New York
my mother the 6%, she would request you to kindly indicate in New York
quelque placement sur a l'intéret legal de 7 % ou au dessus si cela se peut.
an investment on the legal interest of 7% or above if possible.
Je vous aurais évité cette peine, Messieurs, si j'avais été moi meme aux E.U.
I would have spared you this trouble, gentlemen, if I had been in the U.S. in person
cette année, mais différentes circonstances m'obligent a retarder de quelque temps le
this year, but various circumstances compel me to postpone for some time
moment ou j'aurais le plaisir de vous voir. - Je joins ici la note des
the pleasure of visiting you. - I enclose a note of
Messieurs Le Roy, Bayard, McEvers &
Messrs. Le Roy, Bayard, McEvers &

intérets annuels que Mr Le Roy doit verser chez vous a l'avenir.
annual interest that Mr Le Roy shall pay to you in the future.

.Au 1er Novembre 4,100 Fr (vous devez avoir deja toucher cette somme)
..On 1st November 4,100 Fr (you will have already received this amount)
....... 7 novembre 13,750 (que vous avez probablement aussi touchez)
.... 7th November 13,750 (which you may have received as well)
................. 8 may 1,897
......... 8 novembre 1,897
....................... _______
......................... 21,644

De reste, Messieurs, ma mere espere que vous voudrez bien lui continuer
To conclude, Gentlemen, my mother hopes that you will kindly continue taking
l'aimable intéret que vous avez toujours pris a ses affaires, et je me
the same interest in her financial matters as you have always been doing, and I
joins a elle pour vous renouveller l'assurance de la haute considération
join her in renewing the assurance of my highest consideration
et de l'estime particuliere avec laquelle j'ai l'honneur d'etre
and great esteem. I have the honor of remaining

V(otre) t(res) h(umble) et t(res) o(bsequieux) s(erviteur)
Your most humble and obsequious servant


Auguste de Staël Holstein

On m'a dit que mon ami Bayard est maintenant en Europe. Je
I have been told that my friend Bayard is now in Europe. I
serais bien heureux que ses projets de voyage l'amenassent en Suisse.
would be very happy if his travel plans brought him to Switzerland.

Do you speak french?

Thank you very much florian for the translation. I did receive one as well form an old friend via Facebook, which is quite similar to yours. This helps very much.
The only thing the translations do not tell me, which I'd hoped they would, is how the letter got from Switzerland to Norfolk VA. USA to be posted from there. Probably delivered 'by favour' to an agent in Norfolk.

StampCollector1960, I assume you are asking florian if he speaks French (which is appears to me he does, quite fluently) whereas I, who had to ask for the translation in the first place, do not.

StampCollector1960 - I can read French but I can hardly speak the language.

Being a trained linguist by profession, all you need is a good dictionary of a language plus a good grammar book of it, and some spare time, of course, and you can start practising your non-specific language skills.

Now in retirement because 78 years old and looking after my wife staying in our daughter's flat because afflicted with Parkinson's disease, I entertain myself in between with my grandchildren's computer deciphering and translating old letters like this one for the pleasure of it.

Stamps and languages have always been my hobbies (ever since the age of five!) but the older I am getting the more I am getting out of practice even in English, which I had been teaching all my life. Certain apt expressions now start escaping me.

jamesw - Could the clue be hidden in

" .. la lettre qu'elle a
" ... the letter she
eu l'honneur de vous écrire dernierement par le Flash ..."
had the honor to write to you recently via Flash ..."

which I believe to be a ship's name?

florian! That's a brilliant deduction. I was trying to figure out what the Flash was, and that makes perfect sense. Will do a search tomorrow (it's getting late here) for the ship. I don't think that would indicate the ship this letter travelled on, since Auguste seems to be speaking of a previous letter his mother wrote.

Also, a thought I had regarding the uprating of the letter from Norfolk. The minimal letter rate in the US in 1810 was .17¢. That is written in the upper right corner, then scratched out and replaced by .20¢. I thought that may have been because of the distance the letter would travel to New York, about 360 miles. But Auguste writes ' I enclose a note of annual interest that Mr Le Roy shall pay to you in the future.' I think he is sending cash to pay the interest on the transaction, which perhaps would make this a money letter. I was confused by the flow of the text because this sentence is broken up by the name of the company receiving the letter, at the bottom of the page. But when you read the lines together, it makes sense.
According to her biography on wiki, Mama had purchased property in America around that time, with the thought of moving there. But ended up staying in Europe to finish and publish her book De l'Allemagne. I think this letter is in regards to the purchase of that property.

jamesw - Any new discoveries?

When searching for the ship, if the 'Flash' is not found, may I suggest searching for 'Lightning'?

Le Flash might be a generic term, though there were schooners by the name Flash. A 'flash packet' was a fast and showy vessel used in the packet trade. (I'm just not sure the term came to wide popularity as early as 1810.)

The passage " ... la lettre qu'elle a eu l'honneur de vous écrire dernierement par le Flash ..." admits of no other reading or interpretation because the French masculine singular definite article (cf. le navire = the ship) followed by the English word beginning with the capitalised F clearly denotes a ship (cf. le France, le Paris, le Titanic, etc.).

No real followup or new discoveries on this one. I presented this cover to my stamp club the other night, and it went over well, though public speaking isn't my favourite activity.
I have theorized that the cover may have made it to America via a diplomatic pouch, though packet ships were hinted at. My thought is that Madam Stael's late husband was Swedish ambassador to France, among his other positions. Since there were no ships markings on the front of the letter (though I know that doesn't really indicate anything) and the US did have a treaty with Sweden (signed in 1783 by Ben Franklin), and Norfolk's proximity to Washington make that method of transport a possibility. I don't know how easy it would have been to get a letter from Switzerland to a seaside port (Bremen? Marseille?), a week or so by coach? But if the letter contained money, which according to the contents, it did, the Auguste would have wanted to make sure it got to New York. Would he have trusted it to a packet captain?
And as I opined earlier, that may account for the uprating.

Just some thoughts. I have no real proof of anything.

Good work with the translation but just for curiosity

The letter is not properly copied in French on this post and I wonder why

here an example on only 2 lines

vous devez avoir deja toucher cette somme

que vous avez probablement aussi touchez



this is what is written

vous devez avoir déjà touché cette somme .....
..que vous avez probablement aussi touché


Those are common verb conjugation mistake when someone read something in French and another one ( with basic knowledge ) write it.

So my guess someone was reading the letter to someone with basic knowledge in French at the keyboard.

This are only minor thing that catch my eyes.It's very much readable...I'm just curious

I doubt if it went by diplomatic pouch as a Swedish Ambassador to Switzerland would not have had diplomatic pouches going to the US - they would have been going to Sweden.

The most likely explanation is that it was carried as a favor by someone the writer knew who happened to be traveling to the United States and the traveler happened to be going to Norfolk where he posted the letter after he arrived. As such there would be no courier or pouch or other kind of mailing, rather it would have been simply something the traveler put in his baggage along with his clothes and other belongings. Or, the sender himself may have written the letter while he was in Switzerland and was about to return to the US and so he simply put it in his baggage and mailed it when he arrived in Virginia. The lack of any markings supports either one ot the other of these possibilities as being the most likely case.