Need Your Opinion On Washington 3 Cent Stamps , Scott 147 & 184

I have many of these stamps in all varieties. While organizing them I thought these 2 looked interesting. Still a rookie, I am unsure of a few things. I believe they are a Scott 184 and 147. Based on some resources given to me. First stamp, in dentifying the markings area, can it have so much shadow. Hard to make out all the detail. Also , the margin has a border of another stamp right? Does that de- value it?

Second stamp, I believe to be 147. Has the stamps top on the bottom, does that de-value the stamp? In your opinion is the stamp faded?
Treina

Hello,

perhaps you try to make a better photo of the secret mark of the first stamp, it could also be some paper abraded there and that's why it looks a bit strange.
And: Well it does not de-value the stamps that there is the second one appearing, but that they are - because of that - not well centered, that does de-value.

Stamperix
Thanks for the observation. Let me see if I can get the close-ups. Wish they were centered. TJA

Stamp 1 with close up of area suggested:

Agreed, the first is American Bank Note, #184, I'm pretty sure. The paper look is distinctive in this scan. The secret mark is there, to me.

The other American is #207. Here's a corner scan:

the heavy shading around the portrait oval is thinner but you can still see a trace of crosshatching below it. This one has a clear dash cut under the ribbon below "TS". This is not always as clear as this. The first thing mentioned is the key.

EDIT: Could we possible see the second stamp with less flash?

184! Great! Ok I'll get the 2nd stamp close up

Here's the Second Stamp closeup:

Thank you very much, TJA1523!

The blowup of the second stamp is excellent, just what is needed. It shows recutting marks on and below the upper part of the left ribbon, which varies from stamp to stamp. So I believe this is #158.

Here's part of a #147 from a certified stamp from the Philatelic Foundation site:

Very close. The shading below the upper ribbon part is slightly thinner. The reworking on your stamp gives a very slightly different shape to the upper part of the ribbon shown here.

Hy-Brasil
Im very grateful for the time you took with me on these. Really! I appreciate it. I still have many stamps to work through and it is not easy. My daughter thinks I should be "bored," but I am having a blast.