What Do You Think About Bill Weiss Certificates?

Too bad Bill passed on.

But makes me think about his certificates whether they are still valid. Bear with me, Bill always welcomed a challenge to his opinions, but now with his untimely passing, does this make his certificates invalid.

What do you think?

Again, Bill Weiss passed too soon.

They are not "invalid", but how much weight they carry depends greatly on the specific stamp and on who is being asked. For sure collectors tends to give them more weight then some professionals might.

Hi Revcollector, perhaps these are not invalid, but Bill is not around to qualify them!

I enjoy your insights, you seem to be very knowledgeable!

Thanks for all your knowledge you share with us.

Professionals are not fans of Bill because he was thorough to an extreme. The tiniest flaw was spelled out for the world to notice and that dropped realizations. As a collector I loved the man.

ROGDCAM - Sorry, that is not a correct assessment of the situation at all.

Bill's certificates are fine for ebay commerce but were never, and will never, be accepted by main stream auction houses.

I agree that we lost Bill way too soon. WRT the original question, the certs he issued are certainly as valid as they have ever been, but unfortunately as time passes and the Weiss expertise brand begins to fade I believe his certificates (with no possibility of updating) will lose relevance and go the way of Pinchot certs, for example.

Please expound upon this statement.

Can you explain why you believe that is the case?

A search for Weiss on Stamp Auction Network shows over 1000 current and closed lots listed from a number of main stream auction houses as having Weiss certificates especially New York Foreign Mail items, one of his specialties.

Notwithstanding the fact that the prominent U. S. philatelic auction houses and dealers will sell stamps that happen to come to them with Weiss certificates, those certificates are not looked upon with great favor by the same. Mr. Weiss, may he rest in peace, was an absolute expert in certain areas of U.S. philately. In other areas, he was pretty much as lost as I would be in trying to expertize something. Since he did not use the expert committee approach and did all the expertizing himself, this led to mistakes on some opinions that subsequently cost the auction houses and dealers time and money. So the auction houses and dealers much prefer certificates from expertizing bodies that use the expert committee approach; that way the more difficult submissions are looked at by more than one person.

The average professional tended to think of Bill Weiss with the caveat "Anyone can do the easy ones, but he can only do the hard ones by asking others for opinions". I happen to know this is true, because I am one he would ask. Several times a year I would get an email and scans of some revenue item or items he wanted help with. Personally I didn't mind, but I know this was a regular occurrence for him with a group of others in various areas as well. This makes it difficult to assess his certs easily.
An auction house will note anything that makes it easier to sell an item; having any recognized cert is a form of CYA. Which means that most houses would simply copy the description from the cert and move on to the next lot.

Yes, he would sometimes ask people he knew, like revcollector, for opinions on stamps in their expertise areas by sending them a scan of the stamp. At other times he would introduce a stamp via scan on a stamp forum such as this one and ask for opinions. I don't fault him for this because he was trying to get it right but obviously these methods are not the same as having a committee of experts in various areas that are sent the actual stamps and paid per stamp examined for their opinion.

I think that all certificates should be looked at carefully. The best defense is to learn for yourself. Committees as well as individuals can make mistakes. Certainly Bill's strong point was NYFMs and postal cards. I have found that generally his opinion as to soundness is accurate except for perforations. I would not dismiss his certificates because he is no longer around. If you have an old APS or PF certificate chances are that while the organization still exists the people who looked at the stamps are probably no longer part of the organization. When I look at a stamp with an expertizing signature or handstamp, I know that certain signatures or handstamps mean more than others. SA on special printings, E Stern on blue papers, HFC on 211B, WHC on rarities, SBA on a 1c 1851-60, etc. and the same should apply to Bill. We all have our strong and weak points.

Not everyone who expertises gets paid; some with specialized knowledge do so for the enjoyment and for good of the hobby.

Ok upfront not an area I play in. I don't dabble in stamps that have a value that would call for certification. I'm sure if I did I would only have full faith in a committee type of a certification.

Personally knowing that Bill has passed on I would not put any value in stamps having his certification. Nothing personal it is just the fact I would have no recourse if he was wrong.

For the stamps I buy I am pretty comfortable. My real strength is in fakes or reconditioned and altered stamps. To that extent I am still learning every day.

I'm no expert but when figuring out classics there is enough reference material to help. On the stamps I buy a mistake is not costly but it happens.

In any event I will appreciate the judgement of those that do rely on certification and if Bills still carry weight.

So... presumably you would not put any value on the myriad of world stamps out there with expertizing marks from experts no longer living/active... or an APS, PF, or PSE cert from a period prior to when the current roster of expertizers was employed? Same thing.

It's not like you have any recourse now with the major expertizing companies if it later turns out they were wrong. They won't reimburse you what you paid for the item(s).

I think your assessment is unduly harsh.

[Note: I'm not speaking to Bill's capability and knowledge in any area, rather the notion that if the expertizer is deceased, their certs immediately have no value. I disagree with that assertion.]

Like I admitted not a market I play in. I would trust a group or collection of people who do certifications, dead or alive. But if they were dead and its a high value stamp then I'm getting an update.

If I bought a stamp based on your certification and your wrong then yes I would have to have a conversation and some type of recourse. After all I would be paying for a expert service.

Not playing in this segment I am just giving my opinion.that doesn't make me harsh it doesn't even make correct or wrong.

I guess I am going to have to research this segment now, but honestly why would anyone base a buy on a guess with no way to be made whole. In any event for better or worse this is how I see it. But like I said I'm going to do some research and read some fine print to understand more about paying for a certification service.