Show Your US 1851-57 Imperforate Stamps

I find that series fascinating. The idea that these extremely rare stamps were sitting around in an envelope for years yellowing and now fetch thousands is part of it. I finally picked one up a couple years ago - an "Adriatic" pictorial - not a 3c. Pretty sure there are a good number of stamps sold as panama-pacific proofs that aren't. So it's also a 100% cert required area.

Very cool proof txstamp. Am I right saying that your proof was made in 1915 from the original 1851 die? If so, does that die still exist?

The earliest dies were not available for these or the Roosevelt proofs. They used the 1875 reproduction dies.

For what trivia its worth, the 3c stamp was PO Die 90 at this point, while the 1c was Die 89.

Very true. But having Scott called the 1875 issue 'reprints' is misleading. They were new dies and new proofs. Why would Scott call these 'reprints'? I consider a 're-print' as it coming from an existing plate.
Don

They didn't want to call them re-issues since the 1847 & 51 issues, at least, were demonetized and no longer valid for postage.

I read with interest the discussion on unlisted recut varieties of the 3c stamp.

I recently scanned a cover and plated the 3c stamp from it and found what I believe is a unique, unlisted, recut variety.

Check out the recut in the UL triangle on this stamp, plated by me as Scott #11A, position 38L2L. A-relief, No guide Dot, Both inner lines recut, 2 lines recut in UL Triangle with the leftmost line having a stutter-step or broken left recut line, the upper recut portion being longer than the lower section of that recut line.

This appears to be a unique variety of recut.

Color appears to be an 1852 Brownish Carmine with more brown.

Chase & Lund images match this broken recut line. It could almost be described as three lines recut in UL triangle, the leftmost line being segmented into two sections.

It appears that that leftmost line was actually recut as 2 sections.

Full cover images, along with full size scans of all stamps and postal markings from the cover shared on reddit. r/philately user: u/3cWashingtonStamps

Thoughts?

Here is the full cover mentioned in the previous post - along with scans of the two 1c stamps.

One of the Franklins is obviously a top row stamp which I have not attempted to plate, and the other appears to be a Scott #8A.

It is possibly that it is actually a Scott #7 with a very faint upper line. I spent 15 minutes or so narrowing down the type IIIA stamps possible from plate 1E, but I didn't have any luck.

I think that if I would have spent 15 minutes on the other one, I would have had it identified. But my daughter's birthday cake needed the candles lit and the songs sung and the presents opened and I had to wrap up my research more quickly than I would have liked.

Anyone care to offer their opinion?

In regards to unlisted recutting varieties, "right inner line runs up too far" should surely have been listed. For plating purposes, it would be a beneficial trait to either include or eliminate.

Over the rainy weekend, I decided to try plating two copies of the 1851 issue. I believe these are both versions of Scott 11, with the single frame line type 1 on the left and the two frame line Type 2 (Scott 11a) to the right.

I could not find any guide dots in either stamp, so I spent most of the time trying to plate the right stamp, thinking I could get a match because of the malformed first period in the U.S. at top.

The best match I could come up with for that one was 53L5L.

For the leftmost stamp, I thought the 'squished' right edge on the lower left diamond block would help, but I couldn't find a good match before my eyes gave out.

Am I on the right track for these two stamps? Suggestions welcomed for either copy.

Hi Brentabba. Any chance you could split the two stamps into separate images and then repost them at higher resolution? That would help in plating these accurately.

You are correct that the left stamp is #11 and the right is #11a. When plating these I always try and narrow down the possible plates first. Lets look at the #11 first. They came from plates 4, 6, 7 and 8. The left frame line on yours is not faint, nor is it close to the design and the top label block does not appear to be recut. These characteristics allow us to eliminate Plate 4. The bottom frame line is not heavy so this rules out Plate 8 and leaves you with Plates 6 and 7. This is where I would focus your search. Knowing which relief it is would also help narrow your search further. Your #11 looks like a B relief but image quality is preventing me from saying for sure. Assuming it is a B relief, we'd look for a guide dot. Yours doesn't appear to have one, so you could narrow down your search to B reliefs in the 10th vertical column and the 10th horizontal row from both Plates. Positions 87L6, 87R6 are also missing guide dots. Other features to help narrow it down would be:

The right frame line heading in towards the lower right diamond block.
The distance between the right frame line and the lower right rosette.
The left frame line moving in near the lower left rosette.
The top frame line moving out as you go from left to right.

I haven't actually plated this one yet, so these suggestions are how I would go about narrowing down where to look. Positions without guide dots from plates 6 and 7 can be difficult to plate but you should be able to find it.

I'll post some thoughts on the other stamp is a separate post. I hope this is helpful.

Regards,
Harper1249

BrentAbba. Your second stamp should be easier to identify as it has a very nice shifted transfer that is visible in the Rosettes and in the top and bottom label blocks. Also the large white area below the stamp suggests it is from the bottom row. And finally the left inner frame line runs up too far into the upper left rosette (recut #23) and it runs too far down into the lower left rosette (recut#24). I'd start with Plate 2L.

Thanks for the tips on plating.

So far, given that you mentioned points I hadn't even looked at, I suppose I still need more study, but am willing to dig a bit deeper.

Posting separate scans as requested. These both were from my flatbed scanner at 1200 dpi before the forum compression, so I'm not sure how to get anything higher res.

Thanks for the new pics. They help a little but look to be the about the same. I have plated both of these stamps and I'm happy to let you know what they are. Just let me know. The 11 is from Plate 7 and the position does turn out to have a guide dot just below the bottom frameline in the lower right corner. I'm not seeing it on your image but you might be able to see it. Another unique factor is the right frame line does not go all the way up and stops at the top of the upper right diamond block. This could be helpful in IDing this position. Again, I have the positions identified and can share them if you want.

Regards,
Harper1249

Stan, the second (top row) 1c stamp is 10L1E.