What Colour Is This 1861 3c Scott 65 . . . ??

Dear Friends ,

I have posted here an image of a cover with a 1861 3c issue . I will be thankful if experts can identify the colour and the Scott no for me .

Regards , Srivatsan

Any evidence of a grill? color does look like a 65 if no grill is present.

Dear Stallzer ,

I am not able to recognise a grill here clearly. Do appreciate your possibility that it is a Scott 65 .. .

However , I have 2 observations here , which I would like to share and which I would request you to illuminate .
One , as per Robert Siegel , Scott 65 is a Rose and the colour is usually , almost in all cases , very mellowed and faded due to exposure to elements , sunlight or passage of time . This stamp colour is pretty bright and striking for a stamp of Scott 65 .
Two , the colour when compared with a typical Scott 65 Rose , seems to have a touch ( some may say good measure ) of pink or carmine . ( I am not an expert on colours for US stamps )
.
Will be thankful for your insights .
Regards , Srivatsan .

miacon...looks to be a #65....no pink

Just have some of these for comparison for you.




There are all shades of Rose with this #65, It might be that the one on the right is "lake" and someone might ratify that for me. ebay has many characterized as 64's but likely they are not. There is a 64b which is called rose pink and that gets to be a question where having a group of them to compare helps to make the distinction.

Dear Friends ,
Many thanks for all your replies .

Regards ,
Srivatsan

Hi Srivatsan, (or can we call you Sri for short?)

I'm sure that Robert Siegel also knows that there are at least 55 different colors for the #65 stamp, with rose being one of them. They have been identified, and are well documented in The Chronicle, which is the periodical that is published by the U.S. Philatelic Classics Society.

I've been chasing these different colors now for several years (and I hope that Don is reading this and sees that I'm not calling them shades!), and they're all identified by year and time of the year-- usually early, middle or late.

The pink stamps were the first printed, and when they found that the pink ink was not stable, they started to add some yellow in the wash and carmine. The yellow helped the stamp to become rose, and because printing and inks weren't perfect in the 1860's every batch was a little bit different.

So pink is from 1861 only. Some dated covers in 1862 can also have pink, but if it's 1863 or later, the stamp won't be certified as pink.

The darker colors, when some dark purples were added, making some of the mixtures that are Lake combinations happened in 1864. We see Lake Rose, Lake Brown, Brown Lake (yes, there is a difference), and these are all much darker even than your stamp.

If you look through my posts in the past, I've posted some examples of some of these colors of the 1861 3c #65, and some of the 64's also.

Good luck-- I love your country's stamps also, in particular the Feudatory States.....if you're ever looking to trade some for some US, please let me know!!

Thanks, and hope this is helpful! Ray

I found a few images I could share here-- Here is Lake Rose from 1863, I think a beautiful hue:


Here is a Carmine Rose from 1861:


Brownish Red Rose from 1862:


One of the Pinks...Salmon Rose Pink from 1861:


All I can post without using the Optimizer and I need to go to bed!

Chipshot,
Your stamp isn't a lake color of any kind.
At high res scan, with the concentrated area under the top left "3", if you look, you'll see a lot of dark, dark violet in the Lake color.


This isn't the best example I have, but I could put my hands on it quickly tonight. The Lake colors are going to be very, very dark.

Hope this helps...Ray

Don

ray.mac your post is most appreciated as the stamps and color descriptions as well as the reasons for the color variations are most informative. Thank you!

Many years ago, I went to work for a stamp auction house and on my first day the owner asked me how to tell a 3c Pink from a 3c Rose. I was sooooo caught off guard, and I had no idea how to DESCRIBE the difference between Pink and Rose. My boss saw the WTH-look in my eyes and when I couldn't say anything after a few seconds he said, "The Pink has a tinge of blue in it". I never thought about it that way, but now whenever I see a 3c Pink my brain says, "Hey look! There's a tiny tinge of blue!" It is one of those things that one would never think about it, but after someone else says it, you can't see it any other way. Having said all that, I still don't think I would describe it that way to someone else.

Srivatsan, your stamp looks like one of the minor sub-shades (can I even use that word - 'shade' - here??) of Rose and doesn't appear anywhere near the color of Pink or Rose Pink ( and let's not even consider Lake or Pidgeon Blood Pink). By 'sub-shade', I mean a color that would, in the end, be categorized as Rose.

Forgive me if this is obvious (I am a new member) but how do I "see" this stamp? I can see photos in the replies but not the stamp. Thanks!

Scrolled right past it. Right below the first post.

https://goscf.com/t/73080#648775