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French , Cinderella Stamp Imitation Of 2 Centimes , Ceres,1870.

 
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Author Previous TopicReplies: 12 / Views: 755Next Topic  
Valued Member

Bulgaria
398 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   05:05 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add post_pe to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Could someone please tell wath he tinks of this French, cinderella stamp? It's imitating the design of Ceres 1870 issue, S.G.187, 2 centim stamp. It's printed in yellow-orange not in red-brown color,with rough,perforations measuring 11 ,overprinted with a text in black.
It's now been offered at internet ,as a very rare item,with only 3 stamps knowned.
The owner of the imitation claims that it's possible connected by some way to the Belgian stamp dealer ,from Brussels,J.B.Moens .He suspects it's a packet label advertising his business. Is this information reliable at all and did someone encountered other stamps similar to this one ?
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Edited by post_pe - 03/10/2023 05:08 am

Pillar Of The Community
France
2925 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   05:40 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add vayolene to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I assume you read the full story here :
https://www.delcampe.net/en_GB/coll...1644529.html
€ 50,000 ! Wow!
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Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
6526 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   06:01 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NSK to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I get the impression they are asking for info (ab)using the Delcampe shop, rather than offering it for sale.
They may have entered a price of € 50,000 to put people of from attempting to buy it.

Also, it could be a scam.
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Valued Member
Bulgaria
398 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   06:02 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add post_pe to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Yes ,this is the original source . This astonished me ,a cinderella on such amazing price .
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Valued Member
Bulgaria
398 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   06:11 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add post_pe to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Maybe this is why the seller, pointed such high price. He mentioned tath he made a research on the stamp,it's possible tath he is still collecting data about it .
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Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
6526 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   06:19 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NSK to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The 'question' section of the listing is an entertaining read.
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Bedrock Of The Community
Australia
38679 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   06:25 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rod222 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
354181478850


SEE SCAN
Good evening, here is an interesting article: THE MEIHANA A.P.BERRY AND J.W.BRODIE MYSTERY In New Zealand about two years ago, one of us (A.P.B.) noticed an oddity in the collection of a Hamilton friend that he had never seen before. This is an imitation of the definitive 2 centimes of France issued in 1870 - the Head of Cérès, S.G.187 - printed in yellow-orange rather than issued red-brown, on a coarse vertical mesh paper, and slightly smaller in size than the original. The perforations are coarse, irregular and approximately 11 gauge. The imitation is overloaded with two inscriptions in black. One of them, originally set in small caps, reads "SPECIALLY / PREPARED / IN NEW ZEALAND / BY / MEIHANA & CIE". Interlined with this inscription there is another which surrounds the first but nowhere overlaps it ~ it is in cryptic fragmented letters, the original very roughly done, as if with poor pen and India ink. The 'stamp' has already been found. Donald White of Dunedin published a short note in 'Captain Coqk' December 1982, volume 10, page 114, illustrating a copy and asking if they had any more information. Nothing more seems to have been revealed. On what is clearly a second copy found, investigations have been carried out in New Zealand (J.W.B.) in an attempt to identify the "MEIHANA & CIE" of the inscription. Maihana is a Maori surname, and a search of all telephone directories nationwide revealed that there were fourteen Meihana families listed. With the exception of three in Canterbury and one in Lower Hutt, all lived in Rotorua, the Waikato Basin, Gisborne or the Auckland area. A letter of inquiry addressed to each brought a response 57 - Mr. Charles Meihana responded but had no positive information. Thus, we can only guess in the hope that one of the possibilities will strike a chord and lead to additional information. The typographic inscription. "SPECIALLY PREPARED IN NEW ZEALAND" - does this apply to the label itself? It seems unlikely. Does it apply, for example, to a packet of New Zealand stamps, on which the label was affixed, on sale from a French-speaking source, as the use of Meihana & Cie suggests? The cryptic inscription. Donald White interpreted this as reading 'ERGATLISE / BLOQUES /GOURTANS / UDEIU / 18--96 / POST TEINER TIVOISO'. The words have either been recklessly or deliberately rendered impenetrable, but we agree that 'BLOCKED', '18--96' and 'POST' are reasonably clear; however, the other words have been mixed up to such an extent that the first word is just as likely to have been derived from "FRANCAISE" and the word above "18--96" from "MOENS". J.B.Moens was the Belgian stamp dealer, with a very large business in Brussels, well known at the end of the 19th century. The various French words and the name Moens further indicate a French - or Belgian - connection. The origin of our label may therefore have been a packet label, an adaptation of someone else's packet or advertising label, or simply an anonymous invention. If anyone has any leads, please let us know or better, send a contribution to this journal.

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Edited by rod222 - 03/10/2023 06:29 am
Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
6526 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   06:57 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NSK to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I just love the name of the ebay shop that is listing the item in rod222's post! Especially considering the hyperinflation.



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Bedrock Of The Community
12554 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   07:38 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The text in the ebay listing was taken directly from (stolen) the following 1988 newsletter "The Kiwi":

http://www.nzsgb.org.uk/kiwi_cd/vol37/no3.pdf
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Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
6526 Posts
Posted 03/10/2023   08:07 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NSK to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The request for information is also taken from that publication.
It does look like someone is trying to scam or it is a tax evasion scheme.
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Valued Member
Bulgaria
398 Posts
Posted 03/11/2023   04:26 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add post_pe to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I have read carefully the original text published in " The Kiwi ",May edition, 1988, ,from the link pointed by rogdcam. I have also observed that the text is copied directly ,from the original text without properly pointing in the add, tath it's is quoted not written by the seller himself. The only phrase used by the author is -"Good evening, here is an interesting article "could be a atempt to convince the reader tath there are solid arguments tath the stamp is very rare because it's images is published in a prestigious philatelical magazine and his stamp is a newly discovered thert copy . The stamp in the sellers add doubles the design of the one on the photograph ( even black and white in poor quality) at "The Kiwi" magazine.
Could this indicate they came from the same source ? I can't say weather this is a intent to fraud someone or it's a scheme ,but this is the first such stamp tath I see selling at such enormous price.

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Edited by post_pe - 03/11/2023 04:29 am
Pillar Of The Community
Netherlands
6526 Posts
Posted 03/11/2023   07:36 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NSK to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
If you click on 'shop' in the Delcampe listing, you will see it is the same seller.

In the 'question' section on Delcampe, you will find someone who is not taking the stamp serious remarked the stamp is worth ten centimes.
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Edited by NSK - 03/11/2023 07:37 am
Valued Member
Bulgaria
398 Posts
Posted 03/12/2023   04:03 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add post_pe to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I haven't look this section of the add. Ten centimes ,so little ? Taths a lot different figure, from the one the saler wants for it.
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Edited by post_pe - 03/12/2023 04:04 am
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