Washington 2cents, Sc482A?

I would like to show you the analysis I have done of this stamp, it is a 2 Washington cents probably from 1920 without perforations, which I think may be the very rare model SC 482A. It has many things in favor, but also some against, I would need your help to assess whether it is worth certifying it or not. Firstly, for the analysis I have used the websites https://stampsmarter.org/1847usa/wa...ankmain.html (which was provided to me by the user 51studebaker..very grateful for it) and https://www.theswedishtiger.com/482-scotts.html. Also several Washington 2 cent stamps that I have to make a good comparison between them.
The first thing was to know if the stamp is printed on a flat plate, roller or offset, and as can be seen on the pictures, the ink stains would indicate that the stamp is on a plate or roller, all offset models are discarded. As I do not yet have a template to discard between roller and flat plate (although because of the significant Flat Plate setoff, I think flat plate) I would have the models: 409 (watermark), 482 and 482A (without watermark), and 459(rotating).
The stamp does not have a watermark, at least I have not been able to see it (I will need a professional machine for this) so type 409 is ruled out.
At this point, the visual analysis of the determining details of each of the models:
-The rope of the toga is well defined in models 482A and 459, and blurred in 482. As can be seen from the photograph, the rope is well defined in this stamp. I have been able to see this point clearly comparing with my 482 stamp. This point would already rule out model 482.
-The line under the ear, in 482 the line is very white and noticeable, in 482A the line is much less noticeable but visible, and practically imperceptible in 459. I have been able to verify this with my 482 stamp, but I do not have a 459, to compare to what extent it becomes invisible. This point also rules out 482.
-The joined lines of the pin, in 482 they are not clearly united, in 482a they are diffusely united and never more than 4, in 459 they are strongly united and more than 4. I have been able to verify this in the comparison with my 482. This point rules out the 482 and 459, since this stamp has the lines slightly joined together, it is noticeable when comparing it with the 482.
-Hair locks, it is difficult to explain, but two lines of the lock reach the same height in the models 482 and 482A, while in the 459 they end up clearly on par. This is an important point that rules out the model 459 on this stamp.
-The line of the mouth. It is very thin in the 482 model, thick in the 482A and crooked in the 559. I have been able to verify the thicker line in this stamp in the comparison with my 482, this rules out both the 482 and the 459.
These are, in my opinion, some of the most notable characteristics.
Conclusions: The stamp is probably flat plate since, in addition to ink stains bleed through on the back, it does not match the characteristics of a rotary 459 model. A priori without a watermark, so it rules out model 409. The line of the toga and the stain on the ear and the hair on the sideburn rule out model 482. Although all this indicates that it could be a 482A, needs a conclusive analysis of the watermark. Also is disconcerting that the stamp has no perforations and has a cut so horrible that it mutilated part of the vignette, size 22x22mm.
The origin of the label dates back to the 1980s, at that time, no one had catalogs or a professional had them, but ordinary people just exchanged them as trading cards, no one valued them if they were very valuable, especially stamps like these Washington of which you could have many repeats (I have 7, I always thought they were the same and now I know that they are different models, 482, 411, and a couple of them that I still have to investigate)...The stamp has been in my collection since then as a result of an exchange, a gift or from my family's correspondence...At that time many people gave me lots of letters from their correspondence...
Obviously I am not a professional, I have returned to my abandoned collection since the 80s, which consisted of putting all the stamps I found in an album, without classifying them or anything... Now I am having a lot of fun doing it and getting great and pleasant surprises ...and delighted to have the stamps well organized and classified!! By this I mean that it is a novice analysis done out of hope, I know that it will be very difficult for it to be a 482A, but point out ways...I would like to know your opinions.

I would suggest that you return to your id attempt by determining the type of press on which this stamp was created. Choices are (1) flat plate, (2) rotary press & (3) offset.
Oops. My apologies for not reading your initial post more carefully.
Your analysis is quite logical. The problem is likely the difficulty in identifying the type ... I or Ia. I am no expert, but I would wager that your stamp is likely a type I. Simple probability would suggest this. I think the lines of the toga rope need to be a bit stronger. I actually recall buying a Scott 500 from a dealer several years ago. Once I had the stamp in hand, I decided it was instead a 499. As I and the dealer disagreed, he let me send it to be expertized. As expected, it was judged to be a type I (499). I'll let the experts guide you as to whether it is worth expertizing.

Absolutely NOT a 482A. This is a type I.
This might help:
https://stampsmarter.org/

That is a long and detailed analysis but fails to even hand-wave over a couple of important details. The 482A is only known with Schermack perfs, which this stamp does not have, and the 482A is deep rose while 482 is carmine. Colors of individual scanned stamps are difficult to ID on the computer, but this one looks carmine.

In this photo you can see 482 and the supposed 482a...although the photograph is not good, I think you can see notable differences...


482:


Supposed 482a:

All anyone has to look at is the toga button. On the 482A the button is very thick, on the type I it is very thin, as it is on the stamp in the original post.

Murusama: You can find actual examples of certified stamps at the Philatelic Foundation web site (www.philatelicfoundation.org) ... or you can view some of the PSE cert database via Stamp Smarter (stampsmarter.org).
On the Stamp Smarter home page, select FEATURES at the top of the screen. Once the Features screen is displayed, scroll to the bottom to find PSE CERTS ... select the LAUNCH button just below it. Once the app loads, you can then specify the catalogue number for which you wish to see certs. When I looked, there were 7 certs for 482A.
I also tried the PF site ... for whatever reason, it wasn't working when I tried it.

Found this in stampsmarter... http://psestamp.com/Cert/1251213

Murasama,

I agree with all previous posters here, you do *not* have a 482A. Concerning 482A, The Scott Specialized catalog reads: "The imperforate, type 1a, was issued but all known examples were privately perforated with large oblong perforations at the sides (Schermack type III)." The link you privide goes to such an example, note the rectangular hole, although most will have two of these slots. The absence of this feature in your stamp would indicate it is not a 482A.

Second, more generally, there is considerable variation is appearance in copies of both 409 and 482. Both these stamps were produced for a number of years in large quantittes, some naturally from brand new plates and some with worn out plates, which will give somewhat different appearances, not to mention day to day variations of essentially a hand-made product, etc. Some are quite vivid and some are quite washed-out. Lastly, the single-line watermark can be difficult to detect if only a small portion of one letter appears. Assuming your watermarking to be correct, it is quite possible the image you show with two stamps can both be the same Scott number of 482 (or 409, read on).

Oddly, they both have similar cancels like they were soaked off the same philatelic cover and the widths of the two stamps are very similar and appear parallel. It strongly suggests they might be cut from imperforate coils, thus they would contain a single-line watermark as Scott 409V, (as 482 was not produced in this format).

Here is a strip of 4 of 409V with a paste-up between the top 2 stamps. The top stamp with its bottom edge trimmed off and the top tab of the second stamp underneath:


When I overlay your two stamps (with some difficulty being a photo instead of a scan), the cancels match and give the identical appearance to a paste-up pair (like the top two stamps in the unused strip above), one stamp stamp trimmed at the bottom and one having a tab at the top.

I would recheck closely for a watermark, as I suspect you have two 409V singles.

I don't have time now for a longer answer, I will do it later, but regarding the first point, I think I have read that if there are 482a without perforations, specifically 38 in the world... I think... I am speaking from memory now.

482A's are without perforations in the sense of small round holes, but they all have 2 slots, (Schermack type III). The best census listing of these is on the Siegel Auctions site::https://resources.siegelauctions.co...s.php?id=217

You can start here
https://stampsmarter.org/1847usa/wa...ankmain.html

Click on your stamp (which will take you here)
https://stampsmarter.org/1847usa/wa...d32perf.html
This page gives the option to click on the various perforation types for this stamp. The ones you want to know about are the 'Imperf' stamps button or the Private 'Perforations - Vending and Affixing Machine Perforations' button.
Don

I am very grateful for all the responses. After reading all of you, I see that the only way to clear up the doubt is to certify the two seals, 482 and the supposed 482a. My possibilities are:
-Have an expert check the watermarks, since it is beyond my means with my means, and then perhaps: both are 409, one is 409, or neither of them is 409. This will be a definitive test.
-If neither of them has a watermark, then one should be a 482 and the other a 482a, since the differences are noticeable between the two, toga rope, mouth, ear stain, etc....
About the cancellation, say that it is obvious that the two stamps must have left the same post office, but not together on the same letter. This is because, as I have already mentioned, it comes from family correspondence, so different letters left the same office with the same destination on different occasions. Yes, I would like to know which office this cancellation could correspond to, but I'll see about it later... Regarding the perforations, which is the part that worries me the most, I don't know who cut the stamp but they did it horribly badly, perhaps, Just maybe, they were cut... In my opinion, it is possible that when the stamp was printed, the printing press was loaded with a lot of ink (I don't know if this is possible) so the white spot under the ear would fade, I say this because on the left 2 you can see the smeared ink, just like under the word cents. Even so, this would not explain how well defined the rope and the button of the toga are, since this line in 482 is non-existent...
I would ask your advice to know where I should go to send the seals to be certified..

You can do so if you wish, but you will be wasting your money. Neither are 482A, and whatever "differences" you see will not make it one.

Murasama,
If you do not believe us, will you believe a cerfiticate telling you the same thing?
I give up. Good luck.

It is not a question of not believing you, I take your considerations as good, it is more likely that there is a 99% chance that you are right... but there being a remote possibility I think it is worth exploring...