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1c 1851 Plate 4 Stamps

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Posted 02/04/2018   11:56 am  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add txstamp to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
This thread is for discussion of Plate 4 of the 1c stamp of 1851.

Plate 4 was put into use in the Spring of 1857, making it the last plate made, for the imperforate 1851 issue 1c stamp.

The current EKU (that I'm aware of) for Plate 4 Imperforate, is a Ty IIIA used on: April 8th, 1857.

Perforated 1c stamps started showing up used on July 25th, 1857 (Plate 1-Late).
The earliest recorded perforated plate 4 stamp is July 26th.

Plate 4 marked a big departure for Toppan Carpenter, in how they were making 1c plates. Plates 1(e/L), 2 and 3 each had a 3-relief transfer roll. This required quite a few settings, and, was quite error prone. Presumably, in an effort to reduce the error rate, with Plate 4, they made a 6-relief transfer roll. This only required 2 settings per row. Given that there is only 1 recorded double transfer on Plate 4 (10R), that may well lend credence to the fact that this improved the quality of plate entry.

Plate 4 stamps are often very hard to plate, as the plate appears to have worn very quickly and that caused the overall appearances of the stamps to change a lot over time. Additionally, the perforate plate 4 stamps appear to have earlier / stronger impressions than their imperforate counterparts. The prevailing thought here is that they started using the most recently printed sheets first, and the first ones last (LIFO).

The following types are known from Plate 4: Ia, Ic, II, III, IIIA
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Posted 02/04/2018   4:23 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Njs900 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for opening this thread Tex.

This one of my favorite covers with several things going for it.

I thought it my be fun to let everyone comment before I give my thoughts.





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Posted 02/04/2018   4:34 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Njs900 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Repost of 10R4 from the double transfer thread.



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Posted 02/04/2018   5:57 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add txstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Instead of commenting on the rare plate 4 imprint on cover, I'll point out that the addressee appears likely to be none other than Sen Stephen Douglas known for running against Lincoln, for President and also debating him.
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Posted 02/04/2018   6:07 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add txstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
njs is correct. This is a great cover. All 3 stamps have something of interest, and collectively, they make an insane combination. Insane.

I won't steal anymore thunder.
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Posted 02/04/2018   6:08 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Njs900 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Yes Tex, that is the first thing. And therefore no address was needed to reach the senator.
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Posted 02/04/2018   7:13 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add dudley to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Njs: 48-50R4, with 49R4 in its Type 1C version? Rare imprint copy as well.
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Posted 02/04/2018   7:31 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Njs900 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Exactly Dudley.
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Posted 02/04/2018   7:50 pm  Show Profile Check sinclair2010's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add sinclair2010 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
48R4? :)
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Posted 02/04/2018   7:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add txstamp to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
49-50R4

Left stamp is Ty V

Combination: V Ic IIIA

3 types
2 plates
Interesting addressee
Rare pl 4 imprint
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Posted 02/04/2018   7:52 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add dudley to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
That's a most remarkable item, njs.

To illustrate txstamp's point about the difficulty of Plate 4 for platers, I offer the following two covers. This one is from the Wagshal Exhibit, plated as 55R4 (it was sold in Siegel's Wagshal Sale Part 4 as Lot 1201):



And this is one I recently acquired, from the same bulk mailing as the Wagshal cover (dated May 5 1858):




You'd think, given the Wagshal cover, that the stamp on my cover (Plate 4, Relief B or C) should be easy to plate. But it isn't. Despite the presence of what would seem to be good plating marks, I cannot identify it with any position illustrated in the materials available to me.
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Posted 02/04/2018   7:55 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add dudley to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Sinclair, I meant 49-50R4!
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Posted 02/04/2018   8:03 pm  Show Profile Check sinclair2010's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add sinclair2010 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I figured it was something silly.
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Posted 02/04/2018   8:06 pm  Show Profile Check sinclair2010's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add sinclair2010 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Dudley, can you give us a good scan of your mystery stamp?
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Posted 02/04/2018   8:40 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Njs900 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
And the type V is 92L7.

Fun cover.
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Posted 02/04/2018   11:00 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Caper123 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Beat me out on that one Dudley (Scituate cover).
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