Advice Sought On Expertizing Matter

The PF owns a VSC6000. Getting a great image of a grill should be a simple function of the device.

I won't get into the transparency debacle. Most of the stamps that need it should never have been assigned a major catalog number or should have been consigned to the back of the book (I'm looking at you Special Printings, and that includes the Farleys.)

I have seen a large number of items viewed with the VSC6000, and it takes a few minutes to set up a stamp to be properly viewed. Everyone seems to think that people have nothing else to do except scan the back of grilled stamps. It would probably take at least one whole day per month just to do that, so no other work would get done. By all means, feel free to ask Larry Lyons,the executive director if this could be done. But I don't think it's likely to happen.

revcollector, a Scott 112 has a CV of $600, Scott 112b $32,500 so I would expect a bit more effort is made in such a case.

On the other hand I see prices realized on the Siegel site are all over the place including 112 selling for more than a 112b so I think there is lot of stuff happening behind the scenes that might make for an interesting exposé.

Don't you think that if more than one were thought to be required, that there would be more than one in the collection? For example, that collection must have at least 2 dozen #1 examples in 8 or 10 shades. Because that's what is needed. I happen to know that there are 4 examples of Indian Red, for the same reason.

I agree with revcollector here. Drawing ANY conslusions from images captured over years across different equipment is nigh unto useless.

Even if all stamps were scanned at the same time, on the same scanner, in the same scan pass, the only conclusions that could be drawn would be comparative between the stamps in the group, not definitive color assessments, due to the difference in scanner and monitor calibrations.

In-hand assessment is required.

Daimoniom
you are entitled to your opinions about both stamps and the PF. You profess to trust PF certs on the one hand and sow discord with the other. The issues you raised have been both discussed and imo reasonably explained and yet you persist in casting doubt and raising obstructions. The experts at PF (both current and past) have had hundred's of total years of experience. As for issues with staffing levels or poor response to inquiries, Larry Lyons is the current director and the one who you should meet with or talk to.
Issues with the Scott listings need to go to them as the PF does not control the catalog Input or exercise editorial control over it.

As has been written here many times. And when it comes to the exact colour, the device used to look at it may further distort the colours.

Could use Subject cDa29 to correlate the devices.

Given that 150+ years have passed and that original variations and environmental changes happen, why don't you submit your item(s) to an expert group or groups of your choice and let them draw a conclusion.
Any reference data submitted to support your claim would be returned when the committee reaches its opinion.
Of course there is always the chance of conflicting answers or a no opinion since most likely the same few people would see the item regardless of which group you pick.

And after all of that, the fact is that all the Re-issues were produced in very limited quantities. The 123 was in sheets of 150. So the 10000 sold was only a bit more than 66 sheets. So the overall color would have been very consistent. Obviously 112's were produced in much greater quantities, and of course there are shade differences. I feel no need to "circle the wagons" on this. The PF has lots of 112's. If more than one 123 was needed, it would be there. Just as it is for many other catalog numbers.

Just for your own edification, I happen to know that multiple people looked at the stamp which began this thread, and that each has a reference collection as well. So at least 3 examples were looked at. But that doesn't change the fact that the 123 and the 112 do have observable differences. And I never said that it was "easy as pie", so perhaps you should stop putting words in other peoples mouth. And that author chose to call "tendencies" are stronger than that, although it is a good book.

BTW, a Siegel scan and a PF scan of the same item from the same time period might well be the same scan, since there is no reason to duplicate the work. Which just proves what everyone has been saying all along, that scans are meaningless when it comes to shades and colors except in the most general terms.

depends on if the EXIF have been deleted or not, alle Siegel's scans I saw still had them, so you can of course see if it was the same device and then compare them quite good with calibrated equipment (monitor and standard light).

All I know is that I have been to many viewings over many years at Siegel and know how different a scan can be from seeing the items in person. However well they are made, it is never the same. And to use it to claim that an identification made in person must be wrong……or cannot be made accurately…..

producing scans with the same device lets you compare colors, of course, not something magic :). Not to identify a certain stamp color, but to see of two stamps are similar. So checking the EXIF is always interesting.