US Scott 65? Paper? Or 64? OH The Colors! No Grill

Hello All. I have seen numerous threads on these particular stamps and they appear to have large following on the color variations. I attempted to get the photos to show the proper color by using different colored back grounds. The actual stamp may be a little bit lighter than what is shown here.

On the paper issue (I am continuing to attempt to get this in my head but no luck just yet). This one when held up to the light does not show any cross patterns (little boxes) it is just flat as can be with no type of pattern. There is however a consistent thing throughout the stamp where, when held up to a strong light, you can see what appears to be the tiniest thins/holes across the entire stamp. You can also see the raised impression of the interior shading around the bust on the back clearly and with the naked eye and the design shows great through the back when held to the light. The paper is crisp. (If that makes sense)

Okay, I will leave this to the experts here. I think it is a 65 (rose color??), but I am not any where near ready to decide on the type of paper and I am guessing on the color as I am just starting with these little bad boys.

Thank you.

Edit got the scanner out :)






This is not a good picture, did not notcie until I uploaded it.






Better image

Hi Sirrus

I've looked at this one a couple of times- and surprised no one else has answered this.

I think that it is a light rose. Problem is that all three images look different. And light rose looks like pink to a lot of people.

To be pink, it needs to have a "blue" undertone. Also there would need to be some blurring in the lattice work to the just upper left of the head-- it isn't blurry here at all. Some pinks, the ball in the lower left ornament corner is almost invisible it's so light. I'm not seeing that either.

My suggestion to you, and although I LOVE the A25 stamp and colors but still I'm not an expert, would be to send it to an expert. If you're an APS member, you can send a scan to APS for an ID for $5.00. If you're not an APS member, you can send it to Bill Weiss for an ID only for $5.00.

What I've done with Bill several times is: "Please ID only if it's not what I hope it is. If it is what I hope it is, please send me a cert" His certificate can be B&W or color for a $5 difference. If the color is important, I'd get the color cert. You would want to do that for this stamp, if it's pink or rose pink. You can find him on the web as William Weiss Expertizing.

Good luck. I hope that there is some pink in the stamp. I don't think there is, though, but I have been wrong before.

Another place to look, is to go to the Philatelic Foundation website, and you can see copies of every cert that they have issued. You can see from their site, many different shades that have been certified as pink, carmine pink, rose pink and pigeon blood pink. That may also give you a better idea.

Hope this helps-- Ray

EDIT-- it also does not look like the color of any of the grills with the exception of a "D" Grill-- and if you have a "D" Grill #85, that's a rare and scarce stamp. To see the grill better, you can use a trick Weiss told us on VSC (www.virtualstampclub.com). Scribble with a soft lead pencil on a sheet of paper so it's real dark. Then rub your finger onto the carbon, and then rub your finger on the back of the stamp. If there is a grill, this will help it show up better. If not, it still could be a light grill, but I highly doubt it. Also, the perfs on this stamp are much nicer than most 85's I've ever seen. Again, hope this helps.

I did not know that anyone would issue a certification solely on a scan.

Hello Ray.mac. Thank you very much for the reply. I will make a few comments here in a second. I wanted to attempt another scan for you and others. I really just thought this was the 65 in my mind, but was confused by the paper as they have a "laid paper" listed as a separate number. Anyway here are a couple more scans.

Edit: and I just noticed that the "u" in US seems to broken on the bottom. Is the regular?


Okay I previewed this before posting and this appears to be in the color of the actual stamp with it being just a darker. I will have to get to messing with this scanner to see if I can get closer, but this what I have for now, which may not be much help.






Now this is pink: This one is also the right color, but darker than the original.

Thank you Ray.mac for coming in repeatedly to this one for me and taking a look.

I knew the first two pictures were terrible. I attempted to use my phone camera and they did not turn out well at all. The first one was from the scanner and closer to actual color. I could see how people, including myself can get confused by the colors easily.


Being able to see that "blue" undertone must take some long hours of looking at many examples of different stamps of this issue. I will have to see if I can get a few more to add to the collection for comparison sake. You post has taught me a few things and for that I am thankful, i.e., the blurring of the lattice work, etc.

I really will have to think about the expert issue for now as I would hate to send off a less than 3.00 stamp to be certified. Now if someone thought it was really, really worth it on a stamp I post to the board I probably would. But in this case I think I need to learn more about the colors and different issues of this stamp before that happens. I would not want to get ahead of myself. I really appreciate the information though for contacting the APS, or Mr. Weiss. I will use this in the future for sure.




A big thanks for this information below. I will be there soon.

"Another place to look, is to go to the Philatelic Foundation website, and you can see copies of every cert that they have issued. You can see from their site, many different shades that have been certified as pink, carmine pink, rose pink and pigeon blood pink. That may also give you a better idea."

On the lead pencil idea, which I love, do you just lightly use a soft eraser to remove the smudged on lead?

Again Ray.Mac thank you so much for the great information and your opinion on this one.

Should have mentioned that you can easily erase the carbon, carefully with a soft eraser, and it should not damage your stamp.

Thanks again, Ray

Stallzer, you can get an ID from APS from a scan.

There was a 64 on ebay a few months ago that said something like this from an APS scan: ID as 64, but to rule out 64a, it would need to be examined.....

The stamp sold for more than the typical ebay 64...somewhere around $5-600 IIRC. Colors that subtle, you need to see the stamp in daylight, or in white light (Ott Lights are great for this).

I'm going to post another one, hopefully so TheSeal will see it.....I put in a low bid today and won one, and I'm wondering if it has a chance to be a 64a.....

Ray