3¢ Washington Help - ( The Large Banknotes)

First one is 147 ... if you are right about the secret mark, which I'm only minorly convinced of.

The second one is probably 158. I'm going to guess that it's not the hard white paper. Both 169 and 194 were special printings that you almost certainly don't have. So, my next guess is the paper is the white wove not the soft porous. But, if you think it's soft porous paper, go with 184.

I'd put the last one as 147, too.

But all three of these seem vague on the secret mark. They aren't very distinct examples as best I can tell. You want to look at the shading under the ribbon on the left, not the shading inside the ribbon.

I've looked at a bunch more examples now. I think you've got this right. So I'm going with 147, 158, 147.

Darn it, every time you start winning the rat race they find a faster rat.
The ribbon ends on all 3 appear to be recut (secret mark). The last one is soft paper (184) the top one sure seems to have the soft paper characteristics, you might want to recheck the paper type.

I think 184, 158, 184.

A little about the secret marks.
The National Bank Note plates were hardened and the secret marks were applied as a minor recutting of the plate positions by hand. Continental choose to recut the hardened plates rather than annealing and re-hardening. Since this was done by hand, a large amount of variation would be expected. The fact that the plates were hard caused even more variation. The result was that each 200 subject plate yielded 200 different recuts (secret marks).

As these plates continued in use they also became worn cuasing more variation. The secret mark on the 3 cent varied fron a slight thinnig of the inside of the longer ribbon end to an addition of color to the near total obliteration of the lines. The one characteristic of the National (136 & 147) was the smooth arc on the inside of the ribbon especially toward the point that is rarely present in the recuts.

I know, complicated right?.. I have came to the same different conclusions several times and I believe you are correct about the paper types. The first one I believe is American banknote Co. Soft white paper. This is more difficult than I had anticipated..Fun though.

THANK YOU BOTH for your wisdom!. I'm learning slowly but most assuredly!

Russ if your right I have to move these again...lol

so 184, 158, 184? I was, and am almost positive the first one is 147. How can I be positive Russ? Paper type? I now think it's soft porous paper. Almost certain of it. it has that mottled look and the little diamonds albeit all pressed about flat.

Sometimes you can't be positive ... without spending the money on expertization, which would not be worth it in these cases. Get a bunch of copies and find an example you feel confident about. They are easy enough to find. Or be unsure, pick one and mount it where you feel most confident. What's the harm, really?

Actually my thoughts almost exactly. I am going with the #147 for now and just put the rest in the doubles/ID later binder. I'll have fun with all these I'm sure. I hadn't realized all the potential for fun these offer as I.D.ing these is certainly an education! Thank you both again. -Jay