Stamp Value And Collecting

Here is a question/thought. There were 107,000 of Scott # 630 (White Plains SS) issued. Given the fact that it was aimed at a philatelic audience, at least 50,000 must be around intact. Probably more, as there are at least as many intact sheets as singles on ebay, and every broken up sheet = 100 singles. Yet prices are still in the $250 range for a sheet. That means that there are at lease 50,000 people willing to shell out $250 for a stamp. That is a large number of serious collectors. Or am I missing something.

It's not that there are specifically 50,000 collectors will to pay for it, it's that there are a lot of them in dealer's hands at any given time. Some months ago I was looking at an old auction catalog from about 1960, and I remember a lot in that sale of five full unopened packages of 100 of the WP sheet. Even today, there are probably a few packages still around in some safe somewhere. It is popular, and they do sell, but anyone with the desire and the funds can buy as many as they want at any time. Finding them untrimmed with full selvedge is a bit tougher but they are out there as well.

I don't think you can arbitrarily make some of the assumptions suggested.

First, per the Scott Catalog the stamp quantity is 107,398 "sheets of 25" ... not of the entire sheet of 100 before cutting it into panes of 25.

Second, you cannot always count on low print quantities to be indicative of future values. To use an old adage prevalent in the antique market, "old doesn't necessarily mean valuable". Even supply/demand isn't always an accurate indicator, as a lot depends on interest in a given item, and (as suggested in the previous post) how many are in dealer's hands which dictate whether they are willing to bargain price the item to collectors in relation to catalog value.

I have some old (some might say "antique") Scott catalogs that I occasionally use for comparison. A Souvenir Sheet of 25 of Scott #630 was valued at $700 (mint) in 1983 (which was prior to the bottom falling out of the stamp market), dropped to $375 (mint) in my 2001 catalog and remains at that same price a dozen years later (per my 2013 catalog).

Those same catalogs show that a used sheet of 25 was $500 in 1983; $450 in 2001; and $475 in 2013 so although the prices are currently a bit lower today they really haven't moved much over the past 30 years, suggesting that in recent years nothing much happened in the market over the years that has affected their value.

YES....a very large number.
But....this is a common item for 107K issued.
They are readily available.

I just saw one bid up to $250 range on ebay. Readily available or not, is that not a true barometer of their worth? My father used to say, "it's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it"

Are these souvenir sheets used on cover much harder to get? I read about someone who collects these on cover and it looks like it's hard to get them on cover.

Putting it a different way, how many serious collectors are there, and how many White Plains SS are there,. Because you have to be a pretty serious collector to drop $250 on a stamp. So if there are 50,000 out there, there are a lot more serious collectors than APS membership or Linn's subscription would indicate. I wonder if ebay could tell us how many different identity's purchased 10 or more philatelic items in the past year? That would be a good barometer of serious collectors.

Supply doesn't determine value. Value is determined by demand.

Value is determined by supply AND demand. Popularity, both of individual stamps and of whole collecting areas is obviously a big part of demand, which is why some very scarce stamps in less popular areas might catalog and sell for only a few dollars and some really common items in well collected areas might be worth hundreds.

I am one who recently purchased #630 and I forked out around $300 for it because I can not finish my 600s with out it.
Am I barking mad? No but I couldn't get on in perfect MNH and not trimmed condition cheaper.

I consider it as one of the most expensive MNH stamps I ever purchased so far and thinks only can get more uglier in future as I am looking for #500s to collect.

White Plains Souvenir Sheet while plentiful is, I believe, something of a condition rarity. This is a sheet I wanted from the time I was about 10 until I finally purchased on in my mid-30's. The problem with the issue is that the perforations on most sheets seem to migrate on some area of the sheet such that they are very nearly cutting the design even while other examples on the same sheet are XF. I have a sheet that has perforations that are straight though they do edge closer design toward the bottom. For this superior example I paid $625. I look at ebay sales frequently of this issue to see if I can spot one better than the one I have and I can't say that I have. I think the money I paid for the issue was well spent, but I think it would still retail for about the $625 that I paid.

howell1018....lets see a photo.

This ocurred to me at the latest meeting of the Northern Philatelic Society (http://norps.org/), but there are many dimensions in the value of a stamp: Monetary, historical, artistic, technical, etc. To me the White Plains sheet is overpriced and does not have nearly the amount of value (non-monetary) than many cheaper stamps.

Rarity has less bearing on value than you'd think.

A 1c 51 Type 1 (Scot 55, Pos 7R1E) is a rare stamp, about 100 are known. It Catalogs for $75,000 in used. A 24c Blackish Violet (Sc 78c) is about twice as rare as a #5 and has less than 1/3 the SCV. And I'll wager that a 24c Grilled Banknote is even rarer yet however SCV is $7,250 and that stamp isn't even known to exist unused!

How much is a C3a worth in comparison to ANY of those?

Price has less to do with scarcity than demand... or at least perceived demand.

Zeppelins, dollar columbians and trans-miss, are very expensive, but you can't swing a dead cat at any stamp auction or show without hitting gobs of them. They're everywhere. Yet they're expensive because everyone wants them and/or "they're rare".

Conversely, I have items in my collection where there are fewer than 10 known to exist but are only worth a few hundred dollars. Little sale/auction data, thus Scott's prices are never raised, combined with a very narrow collector audience, results in comparaitvely low prices for the rarity.

Scott won't raise prices unless there is quantifiable auction data supporting an increase, yet that model is completely flawed for most items under $250 in Scott, as items under that line tend to be lotted as GROUPS rather than singles, so no granular data ever makes its way to Scott for inclusion.

There are whole categories of varieties that have not seen price adjustments in 20-30 years, so have lost ground compared to the "normal stuff" in terms of raw catalog value. Everybody knows it, from specialist collectors to dealers, but Scott won't do anything about it.

Scott's methods are VERY flawed in places.

This thread got a little hijacked from my original query/point. That it would seem that there are at least 50,000 people willing to spend $250 on a US stamp. Which would mean that there are a LOT of serious collectors of US stamps. If a THIRD of the APS membership is interested in USA stamps (a high number) that would mean that there are around two serious collectors NOT in the APS for every one who is. In other words, the universe of serious collectors is much larger than 50,000 collectors, as there are 50,000 serious US collectors.