Grill Or No Grill 114 ?

Picked these stamps up today on ebay,cheap so I'm not out much.

I can't see a grill on the 114,you guys have been right on with all my other posts so I'd thought I'd post some pictures,the stamps are not even in the mail yet so these pictures are all I have,can't even answer questions but looking forward to your input,thanks.

The blue picture is inverted color,I can see the grill on the 2 cent stamp but I can't see any grill or pattern of any kind on the 114.

If it's used it doesn't matter. It seems no one will certify it. I would bet that more then half of the classic U.S. collectors, on this site, has one of these used 'no grill' 114's. Including me.

I didn't know that,I though they were somewhat rare ?

If you are sure that your "114"
has no grill, then, perhaps you
(might have) a very rare 125...
but that determination would need
to be made by an expertizer...

I'm most sure some of the experts
will chime in on your post...

In the meantime... I would suggest
you re-scan the stamp by itself,
in 1200dpi preferred, and upload
a nice, clear front and back image
for everyone to view...

stampcrow... don't jump the gun...
open your Scott to # 125...

Quite possibly pressed out.

As stallzer said, pressed out. Many were faint grills to start with and then soaked off paper, some are intentionally pressed out to fool others. But if it is used, it has a grill. As stampcrow says, their are many 'no grill used' floating around. At any given time you can usually find several of these on ebay with large asking prices and mis-identified as true 'used no grill'; none have certs, all have wishful owners.
Don

Makes sense, I guess... but even still...
if it was me, I'd be looking at the stamp
under some very heavy magnification, and
if I didn't see even the tiniest trace of
the grill, I'd take the shot and go for
a cert...

disi I don't doubt that there are used no grill, I would swear that I have one. I pull it out now and then and look at it again in different light etc. My point is, I believe there is no expert that will certify one. Soooooo, someone would have to take my word for it, or in this case, stamp96's.

stampcrow... I would not agree with you...
2 reasons...

1. Expertizers are in the business to make
money and accept work...
2. Most use very powerful microscopes, some
use electron...

Based upon the above, it would not be logical
for an expertizer to turn away the work...

disi, I didn't consider the 125. Yes there are known certified 125's. That would be an excellent find!
That might even be the correct cancel that would be found on a 1869.

Perhaps so...

Take a lightly grilled stamp, soak it good, and try pressing out the grill; it is not all that hard to do. I too always felt that once a paper fiber were stretched you must be able to tell at some level of microscopic inspection but I have had several experts tell me that this simply is not the case. Perhaps the rehydrated fiber swell back up with enough soaking?

They are indeed in business to make money and none of them are willing to hurt their reputation but certing something that can't be proven as real. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
Don

Don... I won't refute that...
reputation and integrity are key...

However... as discussed in other
threads... the word "opinion" is
the key word... positive (or)
negative...

Most certainly *real* 125's exist
or it would be illogical for Scott
(or anyone else) to list them...
and, more than likely, many have
been certed...

So, where does one draw the line,
(or not draw one at all)...

Scott also lists a Z grill but that doesn't mean one is going to show up here. Just on the odds alone you have to understand what the chances are and how many have been posted here, do a search.

I think there are 14 used certified 125's.