Dutch And Spain Precancel

Is this what you are looking for?

http://precancels.com/wordpress/wp-...rCancels.pdf

Thanks 22crowns for the link to Glossary: very usefull.
Bye fabiov58

Thanks Rod and 22crows

This does explain a lot. I will keep that url on file.

Chimo

Bujutsu

I've been collecting Spain for a number of years and was always under the assumption that Spain did not have any precancels, until I read this in Theo Van Dam's book "A Postal History of Spain":

"7. PRECANCELS (Franqueo Concertado)
In 1879 a system for pre-cancels was used for a short time, known as "Franqueo Concertado" (lit. "franking by agreement") with the 1878 and 1879 Alphonso XII (Scott Types A31-33) issues, and very rarely on the 1889 Alphonso XIII "Pelon" or "Babyhead" stamps (Scott Type A34).
The system consisted of monthly payments on account for the postage due. This amount was paid in sheets or large blocks of adhesives, which were cancelled at the Correo Central (Main Post Office) in Madrid with an hexagonal marking. This accounts for the large multiples of the 1879 and 1882 issues often with original gum."

Then I found this entry in the book "Billig's Handbook on Postmarks, volume 13, The Postal Markings of Spain", also by Van Dam, that pertains to the same thing including a sample of the marking.



Then I did some searching in my stash of duplicates and found a few of what I believe to be these "precancels".




The 4 Una Peseta stamps on the left appear to be a block of 4 that have been broken apart, but on closer examination of the cancels they are actually 4 different sections of the same type of cancel. They also have full gum. The one on the right has no gum.

I'm not sure if these are considered "pre-cancels" like what are normally seen elsewhere, but Theo Van Dam seemed to think they were.

So I guess Spain did issue at least a type of pre-cancel.

Thx for sharing. Now to look through my dupes.

No problem. I actually bought one of the high values in one of these sets (4 peseta grey, if I remember right) believing the cancel to be a genuine postal use. Now, thinking back, I see the high values on ebay all the time and alot of them have this type of "precancel" being sold as a postal usage. I'm glad I discovered this tidbit of information before I spent too much on filling some of my holes.

Interesting information!
Thank you!
Fabiov58

Chasa:
I don't think I posted to this thread, but I find your Netherland precancels, posted back on the first page of this string, interesting. It looks to me like a roller drum type of cancel similar to the roller drum cancels used here in the US. I think I have seen similar cancels on Dutch Postal Stationery, but that is only a memory flicker, I go through so much postal stationery that seeing and remembering are usually two different things. I don't think I have picked up any with this type of cancel on stationery, but will look through my stuff.

In addition to the stamped precancels, other than Canada and the US, are there any other countries that may use precancels on Postal Stationery.

I found a small very elusive sub collection of US precancels, and that is on US Postal Card Postal Stationery. There are a few that have been issued, but one VERY seldom ever sees any of it for sale these days. Oh well, interesting thread.

Also regarding Chasa's image on the first page, I would like to ask if these cancellations are the ones referred to a 'life saver' types??

Thank you

Chimo

Bujutsu