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Missing Scott Numbers. Is There A Story Here?

 
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Posted 02/11/2021   12:26 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add Rephil to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I have a stamp that I bought in a collection about 50 years ago that I assume to be Scott #36. It is hinged and on the hinge is a very small penned notation "#51 int. bl." This got me wondering about the fact that my Scott Catalog omits the U.S. numbers 48 through 54. These numbers must have existed at one time. Does anyone know the story behind these missing numbers? If so, was number 51 a twelve-cent denomination?
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Posted 02/11/2021   1:00 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add redwoodrandy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Scott numbers 48-54 with the 51 12¢ black are listed in my Scott 1942 catalogue. Notation there is trial printings and not regularly issued. There is definitely more to the story.
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Edited by redwoodrandy - 02/11/2021 3:13 pm
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Posted 02/11/2021   1:03 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NicholasC to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I know that Scott has renumbered over the years as well there being situations where stamps have been added and removed as major varieties. Many stamps in my collection have Scott numbers written on the back that no longer exist (as numbered) or fall into a different issue. I don't believe renumberimg is done anymore, not in a long time, but each update to the catalog includes adds and deletes, both of minor and major varieties.
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Edited by NicholasC - 02/11/2021 1:18 pm
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Posted 02/11/2021   1:08 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add rogdcam to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
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Posted 02/11/2021   1:15 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add redwoodrandy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
For a whole lot more on changed missing numbers. For such an in depth article I find it interesting that the author did not know why 47-54 were missing.He opined they were never listed having never seen any listing.

http://www.tidewatervirginiastamp.c...20States.pdf
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Posted 02/11/2021   1:44 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I don't believe renumberimg is done anymore


Consider as examples, Scott 10, 10A, 11, 11A have been re-worked in recent years. Also the triangles of the 2 cent Bureau issue have been re-worked with the splitting of type III and type IV.
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Posted 02/11/2021   2:40 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add NicholasC to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks John for that clarification of things that are sometimes done. I was thinking too narrowly about renumbering as done long ago. I don't think something like changing a number from 52 to 75 is done anymore, unless it was a huge mistake.
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Posted 02/11/2021   5:39 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add shermae to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The Linn's piece was good reading. Thanks Rog.
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Posted 02/11/2021   5:46 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add GMC89 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I'll do the Linn's piece next. The Tidewater piece is great and scholarly. Very neat.
Thanks you redwood.
Cheers
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Posted 02/11/2021   9:35 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add JLLebbert to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I don't believe renumberimg is done anymore, not in a long time

Au contraire!
Consider the U.S. Special Handling stamps ... QE1, QE1a, QE1b, QE2, QE2a, QE2b, QE3, QE3a & QE3b ... all renumbered in the 2021 Scott catalogue. For the 2nd time within a handful of years no less!! Similarly for J77 thru J86 ... similarly for the Liberty series. All of these done within the last 10 years. Renumbering is rife in Scott. Well, that may be a bit of an overstatement ... let me say that at the least it is NOT uncommon. Note that the renumbering mentioned in all of the above are for "minor varieties" ... a shuffle of the lower case suffixes for wet/dry printing & color varieties.
Added: For a recent example of renumbering of a major catalogue number, look at Scott 1214 ... formerly 1042A.
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Edited by JLLebbert - 02/11/2021 9:40 pm
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Posted 02/13/2021   11:00 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Rephil to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks to all and particularly Redwoodrandy who still has his 1942 Scott. I'm not going to pursue whether this stamp is the retracted #51. It is unused but shows evidence of a botched repair with paper added on the back. Frankly I fear that if I tried to soak it it might fall apart. As is, snmeone might appreciate it as a space filler for an unused #36.

Can anyone here one-up Randy and show a Scott catalog that is older than 1942? I had a 1946 for a long time before it fell apart.
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Posted 02/13/2021   12:02 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add redwoodrandy to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
My Scott 1938 states that #51 is unwatermarked and Perf. 15 black. There are also Government reprints unwatermarked Perf. 12 without gum greenish black. On the reprints the paper is very white.
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Edited by redwoodrandy - 02/13/2021 12:14 pm
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Posted 02/13/2021   12:03 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add John Becker to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
There have been several threads here over the years about catalog renumbering. Each change has a reason. Many of the changes are based on creating clarity or based on continued research. To do a credible, complete, scholarly analysis of catalog changes requires a long run of catalogs. From my own library:

Paperback reprint of the 1868 Scott:


1896. All the world in one small volume!


Scott worldwide catalogs for 1896, 1897, 1898, 1901, 1904, 1905, 1906, 1907, 1915, 1916, 1920, 192, 1923, 1925, 1926, 1927:


Scott worldwide catalogs for 1929, 1930, 1931, 1932, 1934, 1936, 1937, 1938, 1940, 1941, 1943:


Scott Specialized for 1926, 1935, 1936, 1939, 1942, 1949, 1953, 1954, 1956, 1959, 1960, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1971, 1972, 1976, 1979, 1982, 1984, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1993, 1997, 1999, 2003, 2009, 2011, 2017:


Yes, just over 7 feet of shelf space for research, rather than guessing.

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Posted 02/13/2021   5:00 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add reb608 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Scott renumbers when research shows there is a better alternative.

A recent example is the recognition that the 8¢ Pershing stamp was intended to be part of the unfinished "Sixth and a Half" Bureau Series that included the 1¢ Jackson, Scott 1209 and 5¢ Washington, Scott 1213, and the corresponding booklet and coil varieties. It was not intended as part of the Liberty Series. So its number between the 8¢ and 9¢ Liberties (Scott 1042A) was discontinued, and it was assigned Scott 1214 as the next value after the 5¢ Washington.

There are holes in the current numbering between Scott 1100 and 1104. Originally, the 8¢ Liberty was Scott 1101, the 15¢ John Jay was Scott 1102, and the 25¢ Paul Revere was Scott 1103, as USPS put out new denominations of the ongoing Liberty series as they were needed. When it was thought to be final, Scott renumbered the entire series starting with the 1960 catalog. Even then, the 1-1/4¢, 11¢ and later-corrected 8¢ Pershing were still added to the series, and Scott had to use 1031A, 1044A and 1042A to insert them in the right sequence. For later series, they set aside blocks of numbers and left them alone without renumbering the whole batch. The 7¢ Franklin, 14¢ LaGuardia, 16¢ Pyle and 21¢ Giannini remain numbered 1393D through 1400 without renumbering the 1278-1295 original Prominent Americans listings. And later groups of Americana coils, four separate groups of Transportation coils and three separate groups of Great Americans issues were never consolidated into a single block of catalog numbers sequenced by denomination.

The holes in the 1850's issues is because later research made the case that they were more appropriately essays or proofs, rather than formally issued stamps. They now appear in other sections of the catalog. My 2016 Scott U.S. Specialized gives a table with the former number and new number for 8 issues from 55 to 62. Four are now considered essays, three have trial color catalog numbers, and former Scott 58 is now Scott 62B.

For an example in another country, consider the long-running U.K. Machin Heads issues. Early issues were assigned regular catalog numbers scattered among regular issues as they were released. This was confusing and unwieldy for collectors and dealers alike. Eventually they were all renumbered with an MH prefix. That left gaps in the original numbering sequence.
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Posted 02/14/2021   06:16 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add angore to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
This was confusing and unwieldy for collectors and dealers alike.


This is why there is no perfect catalog for everyone. The one aspect with Scott catalogs is they are tied with the Scott album pages. Being assigned a major number ensures a space.
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