Ebay Seller Protection Actually Works - I'm Surprised

This is a long story that goes back 2 months and involves many ebay messages and phone calls, but in a nutshell;

One of my regular customers from China wrote me to say his $818 purchase was in customs and they wanted him to pay a customs fee and he refused. Unless I paid the fees he was going to let customs return the item and demand a refund from me. Shortly thereafter another item worth $605 arrived in customs and he was going to refuse that one too. I explained to him that ebay considers an item delivered when it reaches customs and they would not grant him a refund.

After several weeks he filed the "Did Not Receive" claims and I fought it and won and he was refused a refund. At this point neither item has been returned to me and tracking has timed out.

Shortly after this decision I was notified that he had filed a "Payment Dispute" with his CC company. At this point it gets a little confusing. ebay put a hold on $818 and even though there were 2 disputes they only held $ for one dispute. I called and tried to find out why but no one had an answer. A few days later eEbay notified me the CC company found in his favor in the $605 case but I was covered under "Seller Protection" and no action was needed and I would not lose $.

This morning I was notified the CC company had found in his favor in the $818 case and I had to refund $818 to ebay plus a $20 dispute fee. Needless to say I was annoyed and got on the phone to ebay. No one knew why the 2 cases were treated differently and no one knew who should handle this issue and I got shuffled to 4 different reps. Eventually I got a rep who listened and filed an appeal on my behalf and I was held harmless in this case too.

I was surprised that ebay actually paid out over $1400 on my behalf and I thought other folks should be aware that it is possible.

Ken

Who got the stamps??

The missing piece to this story is "What changed" regarding shipment to China? It sound as if your prior sending avoided customs and a customs fee. Perhaps there is closer observation of dutiable mail articles to China. There have been SCF threads about this on postal exchanges between the USA and other countries.

Otherwise, if the "regular customer" suddenly began to be hit with customs fees, I can understand his response.

At least in the end, you, as was the buyer, suffered no harm. It was only ebay who needed to eat the cost. I don't see ebay allowing this outcome to become a regular event, nor does ebay control the CC company's relationship with the card holder.

My suggestion to you is be real clear with your China customers, customs will be holding their packages in customs and expecting duty. Also understand the CC companies will back the buyer because the item did not in fact arrive to the buyer.

--------------------
I made this post just after hanging up from ebay customer service who told me that yes, the seller was suspended by ebay but my purchase, not sent, paid on the 5th must wait until the 14th before I can begin a refund request for not receiving the item. Yet the reason this seller was suspended was for repeatedly selling the "same mythical item" collecting payments and not shipping anything. Not my first seller problem but still frustrating that I have to wait and play the game over days to get what will be my ebay protection refund.

Not a good question to ask as the answer can be awkward.

If all goes as normal, customs will return the shipment for non-payment of duty. Then if the seller gets both mailing back, will the seller then refund ebay protection as the seller was not harmed after all? Or will the seller just keep the over $1000 in merchandise as a "win."

With regular insurance companies, if they pay for for lost items which later surface, the insurance company owns them.

"What changed"

I wondered this myself and I've heard from Canadian customers that they suddenly had to pay customs too.

I have little sympathy for folks who ask me to falsify sales data or send in a plain envelope so they can avoid their country's taxes. I'm very clear in my write up that I won't do this and ask them not to bid if they can't accept my terms.

"Who has the stamps?" 2 months ago China Customs said on tracking they were preparing to return stamps and that was the last entry. I doubt I'll ever see them. I bet it would be very difficult to return the $ to ebay but I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

My Insurance company makes it difficult to refund $ when the stamps arrive after a claim. The buyer can't refund the $, they must return the $ to me and then I refund the $. With ebay blocking email addresses and Managed Payments this is a lot of trouble.

Ultimately, of course, we all pay for the stamps and this buyer's actions. Like every other company, ebay does not simply take a loss but rather passes these costs along. Additionally, Ken also loses a regular customer. Sucks rotten eggs all the way around.
Don

For good or bad, ebay can be draconian and a draconian fix to the story in the OP is one to be feared until it is seen. I don't see a fix that does not hurt sellers.

Edit: For example, collection of sales tax in some jurisdiction causes buyer to bid lower as they are concerned with the "total price" and the buyer sees lower bids.

If customs duties are suddenly being collected and buyer needs to pay duties, that will be factored into the total price with the buyer again seeing lower bids.

In today's computer age ebay can easily get the individual countries duty lists. There are far fewer countries than there are different sales tax jurisdictions. Then watch ebay start to require prepaid duty from the sellers who then collect the money in advance from the buyer. On paper that all seems fair, except of course ebay will also want a take of the duty fees from the seller's gross.

Edit: Part two, ebay facilitates international commerce which is what triggers customs and custom duties. It is a part the their business model, whether or not they have yet to include it in the business model. Sales tax enforcement changed and from the comments in the other threads, duty enforcement is changing. The ebay response to sales tax has occurred and watch for their response to duty enforcement.

I do not view this as an ebay issue. Like shoplifting, smash and grab, or any other issue facing retailers; it is part of the cost of doing business in the world today. No matter what venue, platform, or sales approach that is used; there are those who will seek to take advantage of others.
Don

Hi
I do not ship to China, however, I am curious how much the customs fee would have been on each of these sales. That is, How much would it have added to the cost of the item.
Thanks

Customer said 20%.

Ouch, as is said in sports, "That will leave a mark."

Quote:
Who got the stamps??

"Not a good question to ask as the answer can be awkward."

Since when has awkward been a problem here?

a) Buyer paid customs and is enjoying stamps.
b) Custom agent is now a new stamp collector.
c) Custom agent returns stamps, which are now lost on a container ship somewhere.
d) Seller gets stamps back and is hiding them in his basement trying to sort the payment/ebay/insurance mess out.

Wonder what the statute of limitations is on this?

pat