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Ben Franklin Imperforate Question.

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Valued Member
410 Posts
Posted 05/05/2014   6:57 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this topic Add CoinWatcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I just purchased a beautiful Early Franklin Imperf. for my collection and am anticipating the arrival. I have finally found a stamp that has the same hair style as me. I may have paid to much but was happy to find one with a doubled LR Full Plume, well centered, and with a similar hair style. This stamp is going to be the first Franklin in my mostly Canadian collection. These appear to be a very challenging stamp to attribute and am not quite sure yet as to the exact plate and position that the stamp originates from. Doe's anyone recognize the doubled LR corner? It appears alot like position 21L1E, but am not sure.

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Pillar Of The Community
United States
6661 Posts
Posted 05/05/2014   10:56 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stallzer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
21L1E should have a guide dot in the LL corner.
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United States
2226 Posts
Posted 05/06/2014   12:37 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Classic Coins to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The LR corner doesn't seem a match for 21L1E either, but I haven't attributed this yet.
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Rest in Peace
United States
1225 Posts
Posted 05/06/2014   07:32 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add artlaunier to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I don't have my books with me but check out 89R2....

Art
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A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed. (The exact & entire wording of the 2nd Amendment to the U.S. Constitution)
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United States
6661 Posts
Posted 05/06/2014   12:47 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stallzer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Also if possible a better high resolution scan might help plating it.
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Valued Member
410 Posts
Posted 05/06/2014   4:33 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CoinWatcher to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the suggestions but they do not seem to match the LR corner. I will post better pictures when I receive this stamp. I am a little ahead of myself without the stamp in hand. The thing that stands out the most is the extra line above the top right LR plume.





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Valued Member
410 Posts
Posted 05/09/2014   12:16 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CoinWatcher to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I believe I have finally found a match for the LR corner of my stamp in Mortimer Neinken's book "The United States One Cent Stamp of 1851 to 1861" page 70-71. He says "Of the eight double transfers illustrated in the group in Fig.1 0-Q, 65RlE is
the most pronounced. This is a marvelous example of this variety as the illustration
attempts to demonstrate. The strong re-entry is shown at the bottom of the stamp
and very little at the top, even in very early impressions. Nearly every line from
the chin down is duplicated, and especially is this true in the center part. Through
the bottom label the re-entry is most pronounced and most every line of the chest
and shoulder is doubled. Needless to state this is quite a rare stamp, equally as rare
as the Type I, 7RlE. But the latter is a type and major variety, whereas 65RlE is
a minor variety, so perhaps this is the reason I have seen far fewer copies of 65R
than I have of 7R. Years ago when the study of our early issues was not so neglected
as in the present day, this scarce major shift 65RlE, was a well known stamp, much
appreciated for its remarkable double transfer. and eagerly sought by specialists of
the one cent stamp."
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United States
6661 Posts
Posted 05/09/2014   12:51 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stallzer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry but I'm not seeing a double transfer.
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Valued Member
372 Posts
Posted 05/09/2014   6:21 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add matttodd1 to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
when it does come in, and if you'd like to have it plated, check out slingshot Venus.com he'll do a plating on this issue for $10, as he's creating an online database for all positions.
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Valued Member
410 Posts
Posted 05/09/2014   7:41 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CoinWatcher to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
The areas of this stamp that really match position 65R1E are pointed out below. Do you see what I mean now?





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Valued Member
410 Posts
Posted 05/10/2014   12:03 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CoinWatcher to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply


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United States
6661 Posts
Posted 05/10/2014   09:25 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stallzer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
It does not appear to be a 65R1E, here is one from Siegels site. Notice the very strong double transfer on the letter "C" of cent and the break in the "N" of cent. Also the entire word "ONE" (Stamp on right)

This pair is 64R1E & 65R1E and the differences jump off the image at you.

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Edited by stallzer - 05/10/2014 09:30 am
Valued Member
410 Posts
Posted 05/10/2014   7:17 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CoinWatcher to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
Why do none of the 65R1E stamps illustrated on Siegel's Auctions have the additional line as circled below in the diagram from Mortimer Neinken's book?





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United States
6661 Posts
Posted 05/11/2014   07:28 am  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add stallzer to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
when it does come in, and if you'd like to have it plated, check out slingshot Venus.com he'll do a plating on this issue for $10, as he's creating an online database for all positions.


Excellent advice, he also is missing the 65R1E from his archive. It's the double transfer which makes the 65R1E what it is and I just don't see it on yours,that being said remember I'm a rank amateur at this.
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Valued Member
410 Posts
Posted 05/13/2014   2:25 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CoinWatcher to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I received this stamp today and got some good pictures which clearly show the doubling in the LR corner and some marks in the O-N-E--C of ONE CENT. Has anyone seen this one before?









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Valued Member
410 Posts
Posted 05/13/2014   4:40 pm  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add CoinWatcher to your friends list  Get a Link to this Reply
I believe this to be a Type II and since it doe's not seem to match any of the constant plate varieties I am assuming it to be a re-entry (non constant). There also appears to be a nice doubled line to mid-right of the LL plume.





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